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Is your beard still burning ?????


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#101 Jeff Pringle

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Posted 18 March 2009 - 02:59 PM

Jeroen, are you thinking it has an iron core from the longitudinal splitting at the tip, or do you have other photos of the sword? I presume you’ve seen it in person, which would be more helpful in figuring it out. Visually, there is not much info to guess from in that shot, and it looks ambiguous to me.
3core1.jpg
The serpent in my blade was done by twisting, a tight series of left and right 90° twists which I then re-squared on the corner. This gives you the sine wave on two faces, and opposing “c” figures on the other two. GEzell gets the closest-approximation prize! B) Since the dark age smiths relied on twisting for most of their patterning, and did a lot of alternate twisting of bars, it fits with the processes in use at the time and wastes no more material than a solid twist. The pattern could have been done by some of those other methods, but they seem less likely to have been used "back in the day" IMHO.
I did a sword back in 2002 with a central bar of back-and-forth 180° twists, thinking that was the answer, then worked out how to REALLY do it on some practice bars, one of which I still have kicking around – I’ll take a photo so you can see what the bar looks like as you twist it.
SWD02s.jpg
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#102 Jeroen Zuiderwijk

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Posted 18 March 2009 - 07:00 PM

Jeroen, are you thinking it has an iron core from the longitudinal splitting at the tip, or do you have other photos of the sword? I presume you’ve seen it in person, which would be more helpful in figuring it out. Visually, there is not much info to guess from in that shot, and it looks ambiguous to me.

I don't have a photo that shows it more clearly unfortunately. But it clearly has a strip of non-patternwelded iron just below the lines of the patternwelded billets. I stood by the sword for about an hour or so, just to make sure I wouldn't miss any detail:) I've got to arrange to see the sword without the glass, and with better lighting in the near future.

The serpent in my blade was done by twisting, a tight series of left and right 90° twists which I then re-squared on the corner. This gives you the sine wave on two faces, and opposing “c” figures on the other two. GEzell gets the closest-approximation prize! B)

Ah, that was one of the two I had in mind:) The other is a strip of iron or steel and weld a wavy billet on top similar to the Waal sword, but done on the billet rather then on the sword itself. What creates the C-pattern on the other side b.t.w.? I'd expect the same serpent there?
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#103 GEzell

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Posted 18 March 2009 - 07:48 PM

The serpent in my blade was done by twisting, a tight series of left and right twists which I then re-squared on the corner. This gives you the sine wave on two faces, and opposing “c” figures on the other two. GEzell gets the closest-approximation prize! B) Since the dark age smiths relied on twisting for most of their patterning, and did a lot of alternate twisting of bars, it fits with the processes in use at the time and wastes no more material than a solid twist. The pattern could have been done by some of those other methods, but they seem less likely to have been used "back in the day" IMHO.

Woohoo! 90° instead of 45°, and you did a much better job explaining it... :)

Since the dark age smiths relied on twisting for most of their patterning, and did a lot of alternate twisting of bars, it fits with the processes in use at the time and wastes no more material than a solid twist. The pattern could have been done by some of those other methods, but they seem less likely to have been used "back in the day" IMHO.

That's what I was thinking, a variation on a technique that was already familiar to the dark-age smith.
The 180° counter-twists look rather cool, too.

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#104 Jeff Pringle

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Posted 19 March 2009 - 11:00 AM

What creates the C-pattern on the other side b.t.w.? I'd expect the same serpent there?

I think it is because the bar faces that show the layers have a stronger visual impact, so the single-metal faces read as negative space.
A refinement of the pattern worth checking out would be to use thicker layers of low carbon on the top and bottom of the stack, a little experimenting and you could have the serpent more cleanly set off from the bars on either side.
sine113.JPG
sine114.JPG
sine115.JPG
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#105 Greg Thomas Obach

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Posted 19 March 2009 - 01:06 PM

brilliant
thanks Jeff.. your explanation is very cool !!!

#106 J.Arthur Loose

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Posted 19 March 2009 - 06:02 PM

~
Ding!

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#107 Brian Shafer

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Posted 20 March 2009 - 12:04 AM

I love this forum. :D
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#108 owen bush

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Posted 01 April 2009 - 10:18 AM

Freed up the the front piston of my monolithic alldays and onions 3 hundred weight today (I have been saving that job for a sunny day for18 months!),its all looking pretty good .I have been holding back from looking at it cos I knew as soon as I got into it my beard would ........

.... BURN !

now I just have to free up the valve (which is half way out and looking good) I am then faced with the do I - Dont I question .
do I install it (I may be moving in 2 or 3 years ) or dont I ?

Install or not install ?
£1000 worth of concrete and crane or not ?
Beard burning or just smouldering ?
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#109 GEzell

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Posted 01 April 2009 - 08:37 PM

Freed up the the front piston of my monolithic alldays and onions 3 hundred weight today (I have been saving that job for a sunny day for18 months!),its all looking pretty good .I have been holding back from looking at it cos I knew as soon as I got into it my beard would ........

.... BURN !

now I just have to free up the valve (which is half way out and looking good) I am then faced with the do I - Dont I question .
do I install it (I may be moving in 2 or 3 years ) or dont I ?

Install or not install ?
£1000 worth of concrete and crane or not ?
Beard burning or just smouldering ?

Let it burn!

(we want pics)
:)

George Ezell, bladesmith

" How much useful knowledge is lost by the scattered forms in which it is ushered to the world! How many solitary students spend half their lives in making discoveries which had been perfected a century before their time, for want of a condensed exhibition of what is known."
Buffon


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#110 musasioO

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Posted 05 April 2009 - 11:51 AM

Hi jeff, I am a french student and I have to write a report on the evolution of blades forging techniques. I would like to know if its possible to sent me a copy of "La fabrication des épées damassées aux époques mérovingiennes et carolingienne". Thanks!

#111 MJDForge

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Posted 20 June 2009 - 08:59 AM

No beard, but my eyebrows are alight!
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#112 J. Helmes

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Posted 24 June 2009 - 09:10 PM

i actually set my beard alight today...on a job site...with an angle grinder. hmmm ...so thankfully...no........my beard is curently not still burning.

Edited by J. Helmes, 24 June 2009 - 09:10 PM.


#113 Brent L

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Posted 24 June 2009 - 10:45 PM

Jeff I could definately see you doing that...
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#114 owen bush

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Posted 19 July 2009 - 03:18 PM

Today I forged the fire grate for a kings bedroom , Alas the king is long dead but his bedroom is burning!!!!!!!


I am running afire , dancing over heated cauldrons and past the kitchen into the Dusk .
alas due to ownership issues I can't post piccies untill August ....................(caldrons ,fires and the rest )

I should have pictures of the dusk before then (but not before dawn!!!)

Keep your fires lit!!!
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#115 Jim P

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Posted 25 July 2009 - 08:18 PM

I got to light my new forge and actually do some work for the first time in ah........ 6 years?
I got to try out my newer anvil and it's better than I would of thought. The fire almost went out, but it's burning now. It's going to be in the 100's for a couple of days, so I'll clean up the shop, but next Friday I'll be at it again. It was a great feeling. Jim

#116 owen bush

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Posted 26 October 2009 - 05:48 PM

I just ha a most wonderful day at the museum of london backrooms........rondels ballocks and swords of all kinds .all very interesting .a lot of it etched (by a previous collector owner ) and its heartening to see all the piled steel construction in late medieval stuff .
great day .
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#117 Alan Longmire

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Posted 26 October 2009 - 08:19 PM

Pictures, you lucky bastard, pictures!!!! :angry:

I'm envious, man! B)

#118 John N

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Posted 24 November 2009 - 03:15 PM

I wonder if the beard starts to smoulder when you dabble with the pattern welded seax??? :unsure:

a couple of months ago I knocked this from some wrought iron and a file..... its not been finished yet as my mind was drawn to something longer, and a little more complicated...

Posted Image

anyhoo, I find myself with a pile of twisted bars awaiting welding to pop my sword cherry and thought I would try somthing interesting for the edge bars

Jeff, Thank you for pictures and description of the serpent twists, I have had a go myself, and at rough grind and etch it would appear it works beautifully. I sandwiched a twisted bar for the serpent inside 80 layers of straight with the results below,. this twisting pattern certainly makes your head :wacko: a little :D

The distortion to the edges of the straight lamintate is from knocking the ridges from twisting back in, hopefully it will all tidy its self up once the grinding commences! Ill show it again in the event of all the bars sticking together in a week or two! Im hopeful that the 4' of this pattern will be my edging strips!

Posted Image

Edited by John N, 24 November 2009 - 03:17 PM.


#119 owen bush

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Posted 07 December 2009 - 06:18 PM

Dang

If I lived in the middle of know where I would be grinding that midnight hour away and forging till dawn .....smolder..... smolder...... smolder.........
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#120 nakedanvil

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Posted 26 November 2011 - 10:48 PM

Didn't know what it was all about when I did my avatar. Hope that's OK. Here's my hand hammer, now I'm looking for just the right rock. Brent Bailey made it for me. We'd been talking about early hammer development.

Posted Image

Edited by nakedanvil, 26 November 2011 - 10:49 PM.

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