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New maker, here. I am working on an order that is a 52100 12 inch long, 3/16 inch thick Bowie styled blade. I do alot of my research and studying on youtube (it's just how I learn best) watching videos made by reputable knife makers (i.e. Jason Knight, Kyle Royer, Fire Creek Forge, etc.) And their processes of working with certain types of steel and so on. I saw that on one of the videos I had studied for 52100 steel, the maker heat treated, cryo treated and then tempered. My reason for posting this, is to obtain a detailed proper description on the steps taken to complete this process. I use a homemade coal forge that gets more than hot enough to attain fairly controllable heat treat temps for doing my own heat treatments (I will soon be upgrading my entire setup to an actual professional level very soon, I know that my described setup isn't really ideal). The cryogenic treatment was achieved with dry ice and ethanol and I would like to use this method to acquire a few extra points of hardness in this 52100 knife and give my customer a super strong blade. If this is the wrong place to post this, I apologize. Please let me know where to move it to or where to go to read about this specific process, if that is indeed the case. Thanks!!

My understanding is that 80CrV2 is basically 1084, but obviously with some extra stuff. Apparently the added vanadium helps refine the grain size? If my heat treating is SUPER basic (heat a little past magnetic and quench in canola, temper in the oven) am I likely to see ANY difference between the two? My guess is no. If I switch to a real quenchant (Parks), how about then? For that matter, am I likely to see a difference with 1075?

Hello Everyone, I'm in the process of building a HT oven and am trying to decide which way the door should swing. A lot of the builds I see, and most of the commercial offerings have side swinging doors, but a down swinging door on the other hand could be weighted for automatic closing. I do wonder how much heat the door would be able to radiate at your hand while grabbing blades. Does anyone have any thoughts or practical experience with either door type? I've attached a rough model of my design with a down swinging door for reference.

I picked up an Evenflow ceramics kiln over the weekend for way cheap, all of the elements work great. It is an older model so it uses cones for temp. control. So here is my current tentative plan, since I only have $40.00 invested so far, save up to purchase a kilnsitter temperature controll unit (about $250) , cut a hole in the top which would allow blades to be suspended on wire and pulled when ready (cover with fire brick when needed). Has anyone here ever done anything like this befor? If so I would love to hear your thoughts, differing ideas etc. even if you think I should just sell the thing to a ceramic artist and move on haha.

I'm making a throwing knife and was wondering at what temp it it the best to heat treat. But I need to know in color of the steel. And then how long do I put in the oven for and at what temp for. Do I have to heat the tip hotter?

hi guys, quick question. I am making an EDC out of 1084 from Jantz. I forge welded a length of chainsaw chain down both sides and then forged and ground to shape. heat treat was per Allen Longmire in the "heat treat by alloy" section. doing the final grinding I decided to do the "brass rod test" and my edge is soft. any idea where I might have gone wrong? I didn't burn the edge grinding, quench was in warm vegetable oil and I did three hours at 400 deg. for temper. any thoughts as to what went wrong would be greatly appreciated.

Hi guys i meed advice i got some cheap stainless steel but im a beginner and besides that its stainless i dont know what composition it has. Any advice on how to heat treat would be appreciated i want atleast attempt to heat treat it. If this does not belong here please tell me where to post it.

I got a box of A2 at an auction. It included a 3/4X1 1/4 inch flat bar. I used it to make a tang filing jig I have seen on the net. I used 3/8 inch W1 drill rod for the pins. Now I need to heat treat the blocks. I found a recipe that called for stress relieving, preheat, and hardening. Do you keep the part in the same foil for each cycle? After hardening do you take it out of the foil to cool in "still air"? Should I set it on a brick or metal to cool? They describe putting wood in the foil. Would wrapping the part in paper do the same thing? Is there a need to heat treat the pins? Is there something I am overlooking? Thanks!

I'm new to the forum and blade smithing. I've read that railroad tracks and railroad clips are more or less the same as 1060. I have a good bit of both, but I can't find anything on how to heat treat 1060. I.e. How hot to get the blade, Water or oil quench and how hot to get it. What temp to temper it at. Thanks

I hardened a ball-peen 'hawk and my karambit last week, quenched in peanut oil, and then baked at 400 degrees for 2 hours. When they came out, they looked like this: Is this the dark straw color we're trying to achieve? If so, it's the high point of my week!

Gentlemen, I am not sure if I should post this under tools, but his is the newby section, so here I go. I am rather new to making knives and would like to eventually work my way up to swords, I would like some advice on a few different items in regards to tools, heating and materials. 1) After combing through the internet I believe I have decided upon a grinder to purchase, I have decided spend the cash first, (and once). I am look in at a BEE Grinder 2 x 72 but I am wondering what the difference/advantage/disadvantage would be between: A) The 1 hp and the 2 hp, The single speed vs the variable speed, C) A 8” contact wheel vs a 10 “ contact wheel, D) A smooth contact wheel vs a serrated wheel. Obviously the price goes up depending upon which accessories are added and I am trying not to break the bank. Below is a link to a supplier I have located with the descriptions. https://www.knifemaker.ca/BEE-Grinders 2) I am considering a heat treating oven as opposed to a propane forge due to the accurate temperature control capabilities for annealing, heat treating and tempering. I have found one that may be sufficient in regards to size for a sword and may be used for a knife simultaneously (I believe, although it may waste a lot of energy for knives alone). It is an Evenheat KF 49.5 Oven Setpro Control 10"W x 6.5"H x 49.5"D 240v. What I am wondering is: A) Am I nuts or should I be looking into a propane forge for one third or less of the price Could this do the job for both a knife and a sword C) Would I be better off getting a custom one built where it opens like a coffin from the top (as I have read nothing but good reviews about these coffin custom builds) D) Does anyone have any experience with this type of oven and what is your opinion on the Setpro temperature controller Here is a link to the oven I am considering with its description. http://usaknifemaker.com/knife-making-machinery/heat-treat-ovens-and-accessories-c-57/evenheat-kf-49-5-10-wx6-5-hx49-5-d-w-setpro-control-240v.html 3) I am having trouble locating a band saw that can cut metal under $1000.00, but the Proxxon MICRO Bandsaw MBS/E may be suitable for a decent shop, any thoughts or opinions? http://www.proxxon.com/us/micromot/37172.php?list 4) My final question is in regards to the handle material known a Pakkawood/Dymondwood, I have worked with this material in the past and now knowing that the factory has gone the way of the dinosaur, I have found a replacement that may be suitable, so this is also a passing on of information to those whom may not know of it, but I would like to know if anybody has used it and would recommend it. Webb Wood. https://webbwood.com/about_webbwood.php Thanks for any assistance you are willing to give. Josh

I'm new here. I've been making knives for a couple years now but I've always struggled getting the heat treat right. I have a forge and have read everything on this forum and others about heat treating. Here's what's happening. I anneal the blade three times, I heat it to nonmagnetic and then quench. After I clean off the scale I see these raised areas in the steel. Almost like little bubbles. I'm very careful to not overheat the blade but I think thats what happening and I'm seeing grain growth. I'm not sure. This usually happens when I'm using 1095. Can anyone take a look at these pictures and tell me what they think? Or is this normal and this just has to be ground off after the HT? Thanks for the help.

So I started making a spear today, partly as a secondary weapon for hunting our local feral pigs, but mostly just because I felt that I needed one. I wanted to use 1045 laminated with 5160 core, like san mai, but the local Alro doesn't carry "exotic" steels, so I went with 1018 and the venerable mystery steel. In this case, it's small gauge railroad track, pulled out of state forest along the AuSable river, most likely from a logging track. I used an angle grinder to cut the top off of about 14" of track, forged one end flat, normalized thrice using my Mark II eyeball to gauge temps, and quenched in weak brine. To my happy surprise, it hardened beautifully, and from my limited experience with grain size, it appears to have very a fine grain, comparable to the professionally HT'd stainless I run at work. Questions, critique, and suggestions welcome. I feel a duty to warn that progress will be extremely slow, as my forge is 2 hours away from my "normal" residence (apartment) that I am at no less than 5 days a week. Unless there is a fellow smith in the Saginaw/Reese area that wouldn't mind me using a corner of their property? Chase Here's a pic of the broken end: And a pic of the envisioned spearhead:

I got an email this morning from ASM. Apparently they put out an app for Android and Apple products for heat treat information. I downloaded it and checked out the 52100 information and it looked pretty cool. Best part is that it is FREE! Just go to the respective store for your device (Google Play or iTunes) and search for "Heat Treater's Guide Companion". As far as I can tell it is for a mobile app only, no desktop version (for free at least).

I forged my first real cable damascus blade today, with mystery cable, most likely improved plow steel. It is a triple core blade, but I didn't get the defined herringbone pattern I wanted I normalized by bringing it to non-magnetic 3 times and air cooling to ambient temp, then brought to non-magnetic and did a full quench in preheated automatic transmission fluid. The problem is that the edge of the blade didn't harden to my liking. The spine and first .75 inches of the tip are hard, but the rest is fairly easy to cut with a file. Any ideas why this happened and/or how to fix it? Dimensions: 7" OAL Distal: .125 to .0625 over 3.25" thickness of cutting edge: .046 (3/64") Pictures: (not sure what the max is, so I'll go conservative)

Just wanted to share a little something that people may be interested in. This is a product that we use at work to prevent carbon pick-up during carburization/case hardening. This is applied to surfaces that are to be welded or machined after heat treat to prevent those surfaces from picking up carbon. Obviously this should work the other-way around and prevent de-carburization/scaling. It isn't overly cheap (we buy a lot of it and still pay just under $50/1gal. tub), but it is designed for this application and works well. At some point I will snag an "empty" pail from a garbage can, scrape what I can out, apply it to a blade and show before and after pics. But don't hold your breath on that. If someone wants to try it sooner than I get around to it I thought I should share.

A while back I started on a pair of mountain-man style throwing knives. They were cut from some random square tubing a friend of mine had lying around. I wasn't too concerned with the quality of the steel, since they're going to get thrown and banged up any way. I got them ground down and shaped, and cold-hammered the edges (this was before I'd built my forge). When I got my forge built, I decided to use a clay temper to harden them. (Please keep in mind I was still mostly clueless about what I was doing at this point). For clay, I used white clay that is all over my place about 2 feet under ground. I mixed up a good thick paste, and smeared it on the blades, leaving the edges bare. I think it was about 1/4 inch thick on the spines. Then I heated them orange-hot in the forge, and quenched them in water. The clay all came off, and I was left with a weird "splatter" pattern all over the blades. It's fairly deep,too. It has a texture you can feel. What is it? What caused it? And how do I avoid it on future blades that I want to look good?

I've seen different posts where people quench their blades in peanut oil, canola oil, or various other oils onions, or brine. In my shop, I have 8 gallons of used motor oil. I've used to to harden several blades and a few tools and it works, other than the black scale it leaves behind. My question is: Does the type of oil matter? Is vegetable oil versus motor oil any better or worse? Why do we warm the oil up first? If the idea is to cool the steel, wouldn't we want cooler oil? And if a man was to make his own brine, what ratio of water to salt would he need? And would iodized or water softener salt work?