A different way to make steel by...

[tell]

I think the furnce was not running hot enugh i did not get a third of the slag in mine i ran it F hot it seperated nicely and i draind it off

just before i turnd the blower off virtualy blew the sucker out the bottom im still trying to get my hands on a drop saw to cut the son...

 

but i got on my trip around aussie soon so getting ready for that be away for about 4 to 8 weeks ill try to get it done before i head off guy's

 

cheers tell

[igrec]

Yes I mean slag, I can see some black lines and I guess the steel is not welded where they are.

[Jesus Hernandez]

I am not really sure if you are looking at slag inclusions. In our test the slag seems to separate nicely from the metal. It could be because of the different refractory used to build the furnace. If it is slag then simply fold and weld a few times to get a clean piece of metal.

[igrec]

Thanks for your reply. I am very impressed by your work and your kindness.

[tell]

Ok here goes i finaly got a new putor and camera so heres a spark test so you tell me ha ha

 

 

 

this pic may be better to see

 

 

 

 

 

 

i have pounds of this stuff ha ha ha tell

Edited June 17, 2009 by tell

[John Martin]

First off,

 

Thanks for posting this thread, it is really interested and now I am interested.

 

First, does it matter what kind of clay that I use for it???

 

Will this furnace need to be re-built after a few uses (other than the floor) or will it be good for a while?

 

Can I use mild and W1 in it, or should I just use mild steel?

 

Thanks,

John

[Jesus Hernandez]

First off,

 

Thanks for posting this thread, it is really interested and now I am interested.

 

First, does it matter what kind of clay that I use for it???

 

Will this furnace need to be re-built after a few uses (other than the floor) or will it be good for a while?

 

Can I use mild and W1 in it, or should I just use mild steel?

 

Thanks,

John

 

 

Any refractory clay will work.

 

Any furnace will sustain some erosion in its walls and will need to be patched up. The worse case scenario is when the bloom/slag gets "stuck" to the walls. Then i t is hard to remove the bloom without significant damage to the walls.

 

Any from of plain iron oxide will work as ore. I would recomend to avoid alloying elements in the ore.

[Skip Williams]

For those of you following this thread, you will also enjoy reading the posts from Louie Mills in the Knifemaker Interview Series on this same forum

 

starting here

[Tom Megow]

Any from of plain iron oxide will work as ore. I would recomend to avoid alloying elements in the ore.

Jesus would mild steel Swarf from a machine shop work? in stead of ore??

I just read this thread for the first time and am fascinated by the process.

This is newb question for sure. I have not figured out how you get the carbon

in the iron to make steel, from charcoal?

[Jesus Hernandez]

The charcoal is both the fuel and the source of carbon.

 

As for using machine shop shavings, I suspect that it will work. Try it and let us know how you did.

[Tom Megow]

The charcoal is both the fuel and the source of carbon.

 

As for using machine shop shavings, I suspect that it will work. Try it and let us know how you did.

Jesus I will read this thread a couple times to see if I can

understand how this works. I am fairly sure I can make the

"smelter" but how much of what to add is what I need to figure

out. Thank y'all for sharing this. It is very cool!!

[Skip Williams]

Time for me to bring this thread up to date.

 

Thanks to everyone for pictures of their experiments and the feedback. Scott Mack, Tell, and Igrec, you all seems to be masters of the art so please keep us updated with your latest ideas.

 

Tom Megow, you should be able to melt down any kind of steel you have. Personally, I've started collecting aged Chrome Steel ball bearings, Stainless Steels of various sorts, and high-tech bicycle frames from the old days when they were made of chrome-moly steel. All of these things should make some mighty nice ingot steel.

[Skip Williams]

The steel making process can also be done in a hearth with a horizontal tuyere. The main difference seems to be that the maximum carbon content is limited to maybe .7%

 

Back in May, Lee Sauder and Michael McCarthy put their heads together to do a short set of experiments with a hearth style melt. This first photo gives you a general idea of the construction and dimensions of the hearth.

 

 

 

The hearth in operation looks like this

 

 

 

This is a little ingot I made in the hearth from the bucket of cut-offs and old nuts and bolts lying around the band saw.

 

 

 

Nice sparks, but the carbon content is nothing like the 1.5% we get with the shaft furnace (see above posts).

 

 

 

Michael was kind enough to work this piece down into a bar.

 

 

 

 

At this point Lee can jump in with comments about the hearth bottom if'n he wants to.

[Tom Megow]

Time for me to bring this thread up to date.

All of these things should make some mighty nice ingot steel.

Mr Williams

many thanks for the update. I watched a smelt once but they used a crucible.

Are you just putting the scraps onto hot coals ? Then adding more charcaol on top

from time to time

[Skip Williams]

Are you just putting the scraps onto hot coals ? Then adding more charcaol on top

from time to time

 

Yep, pretty much.

[igrec]

Hello everybody

 

The best results I ever had was when I used old wooden barrels hoopings. They are made out of what seems to me to be pure iron. As it's very thin, something like 1 mm including rust, I cut a 16 cm long piece that I fold in 4. I prepare 1,1 kg of these pieces to get 900g of steel.

 

The starting material and his spark test :

 

 

Then I form a flat bar directly from the bloom I get to get this :

 

The bloom weights 900 g, and the process produces a nice slag which sticks easily to the magnet (a bit of rust reduction?)

 

This is the spark test of the result :

 

 

When I use carbon steel junks mixed wit can caps or bolts, the bloom is not very easy to weld. Chunks are falling appart, and the carbon content is less homogenous. I compact it with a mini hydraulic press (an other giant thread on the forum) and it works very well. I already made a wakisashi whith my steel and the steel hardened beautifuly. This steel is also very easy to polish compared to factory ones.

Some little welding defect but this was my first time at folding steel. I started all over again and I hope I will improve my skills.

Please excuse my english and continue to share knowledge.

Edited August 12, 2009 by igrec

[Scott Mack]

Well i finely got my press up and running so i worked the ingot shown earlier in this thread. folded 12 times. 9.75 x 1.06 x .150 Scott

[Jesus Hernandez]

That looks very nice. Great job.

[Niko Hynninen]

WOW!

 

That look nice...Hada just jups up..and hamon Love it.

 

Nice work.

 

Did you notised differens on spark after 12 folds ?

..is it like 0,7% C

 

Niko

[MichaelBrauer]

Greetings!!

 

I myslef have just made a small furnace, it works tremendously well!! I will post photos when I can, and give all the specs. Nice work and thank you for sharing!!!

 

 

Here are a few photos, I will be taking more and will post a new topic shortly.

Just melted some rebar, cant really see the sparks soo well, but it sparks like a file!

 

[/img]

 

 

[/img]

[MichaelBrauer]

 

 

 

 

Hope they uploaded this time! Sorry!

[Kenon Rain.]

Hey, not to bring this thread form the dead, but.. can I build a furnace out of fire brick for this? I don't really see why not, but I guess my question is, would the firebrick be adequate to provide slag? Believe it or not we have very little clay or sand in our soil, its mostly plant matter, loam, and rock, so I'm sort of.."digging" for alternatives.. I did a charcoal run this evening, and I have a bunch of failed water quenched blades I'm agitated with that I would like to have reborn, so I'm set as soon as I figure out the furnace design.

 

Thanks

 

 

Oh, also, instead of building a furnace, could I just dig a 6x 12 hole, beat down a tuyer, line it with pottery clay mixed with charcoal fines, and fire it up? or would the earth's dampness mess with it?

Edited December 4, 2009 by Kenon Rain

[Jesus Hernandez]

There are a thousand plus one ways to make a furnace. Any kind of refractory material will work for the walls.

In this type of furnace slag is not a particular concern.

[Kenon Rain.]

alright, great, thanks

[Jeroen Zuiderwijk]

Oh, also, instead of building a furnace, could I just dig a 6x 12 hole, beat down a tuyer, line it with pottery clay mixed with charcoal fines, and fire it up? or would the earth's dampness mess with it?

While not having any experience in the different steel making method, I've got plenty of experience with on the ground and in the ground build furnaces. Both give you the same heat, but in the ground based one it's recommended start a fire in it some hours in advance, and have it heat up the soil around. Then the heat leakage will be minimal when you start up the process.