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Kurt

Kurt's Design Thread

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There won't be any actual metal in this thread for a while, if ever. I'll post new things when I make them.

 

This idea struck me last night at 3AM, let me know what you think! Critique it as if you were going to buy it.

 

It's a slight variation of a westernized tanto blade, with a brass hilt (That things called a hilt, right?) and pins. The wood will probably be a single piece of maple, stained a deep red, oval-ish in shape.

 

Question: Why do people only use one pin? Two pins provides so much more stability.

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Edited by Kurt

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On a hidden tang knife all you really need is a single pin as it's there for extra insurance at retaining the blade should the epoxy fail, especially good on larger choppers.

 

Two pins just doubles that and is more of a design element.

 

On a full tang knife, two pins are much more neccessary as the tang is not enclosed in the handle material, so in that instance the pins help protect against shear stresses which are a weak point for epoxy. If you pein the pin, or use something like a corby bolt, they then even help hold on the scales, once again should epoxy fail.

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So... what do you think? I'm trying my best to incorporate things that you guys do, but right now my own thing strays from that a little. One is a machete and one is a fighter, I guess. They started off as a straight tanto and I just kept changing things from there.

 

Do you think they'll make decent knives?

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I like the last two the best honestly the first one looked funny meaning it didnt flow as you guys say.

 

the first of the second two is good just the way it is the sec of the two I would use only two or three pins ans scandi grind the hole knife that be wicked

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I like the last two the best honestly the first one looked funny meaning it didnt flow as you guys say.

 

the first of the second two is good just the way it is the sec of the two I would use only two or three pins ans scandi grind the hole knife that be wicked

I agree. I was going to say the same thing. Well, the fighter needs a guard.

Edited by MJDForge

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You mean scandi grind the whole BLADE? Or bevel the handle as well? And just to clarify, a scandi grind is just a flat grind, right? No curves in the ground area.

 

As far as the pins, I too don't like the pins the way they are, but in my head it gave it a very... "industrial" feel. I don't want to loose this feel, I like it a lot, I'm just having some trouble conveying it in to a handle design.

 

And as far as the first one flowing, I literally just flipped the blade shape and turned it in to a handle.

 

In other news, the government called today, I have an interview next week for a small business grant (NOT loan! :D). If all goes well, I could be up and running by June.

 

How does this look?

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Edited by Kurt

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How does this look?

 

Better, but i think the top end of the guard may bother your hand a little unless you bend it the other way and make an "S" curve.

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Thar. I experimented a little with the machete (a strip of rosewood or steel along the side through the pins, wood burning, etc.) but it all circled back to three pins. The handle is going to be ebony, I think.

 

Stay tuned for more in the next day or two.

 

How hard is it to grind a dagger evenly?

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Don't be afraid to tell me how much I suck. How else can I learn?

 

Where can I get something like ivory but something that is reasonably priced and not cruelty to animals? I was thinking bone but that's hollow in the middle.

 

I still can't figure out the guard. I'm thinking a straight circle guard would be just fine.

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You can use "bovine ivory" as Jim Hrisoulas calls it. It is some form of cow bone, and I think he uses it alot. check out his website. you can stabilize with epoxy.

the cows are gonna die anyway (so is everything else, but you get it.).

 

Kevin

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You can use "bovine ivory" as Jim Hrisoulas calls it.

 

Yep, the "bovine ivory" as I understand it is just a matter of getting a really large cow bone thats big enough for you to get slabs out of it, you may even have to straighten the slabs by boiling them in fat or something then pressing them flat with weight and allow them to cool, but I could be wrong. It's always sounded interesting to try, I guess you could get a chunk of bone big enough at the butchers.

 

How hard is it to grind a dagger evenly?

 

It can be fairly difficult for a beginner, it definatly should'nt be the first blade you try, or maybe even among them. :lol:

They're twice as hard to foge, twice as hard to grind, and twice as hard to heat treat without total warpage IMO. Mind you that's all just my opinion though.

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Yep, the "bovine ivory" as I understand it is just a matter of getting a really large cow bone thats big enough for you to get slabs out of it, you may even have to straighten the slabs by boiling them in fat or something then pressing them flat with weight and allow them to cool, but I could be wrong. It's always sounded interesting to try, I guess you could get a chunk of bone big enough at the butchers.

 

 

 

It can be fairly difficult for a beginner, it definatly should'nt be the first blade you try, or maybe even among them. :lol:

They're twice as hard to foge, twice as hard to grind, and twice as hard to heat treat without total warpage IMO. Mind you that's all just my opinion though.

 

 

 

The cow bone that Jim uses is the same as you can get at Petsmart or Petco, or any petshope. I don't believe thats where Jim gets his, I think he buys it in bulk somewhere. Every time I go to get pet stuff I check out the bones, and if they have one the right size I get it.

 

Tony G

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You mean scandi grind the whole BLADE? Or bevel the handle as well? And just to clarify, a scandi grind is just a flat grind, right? No curves in the ground area.

 

As far as the pins, I too don't like the pins the way they are, but in my head it gave it a very... "industrial" feel. I don't want to loose this feel, I like it a lot, I'm just having some trouble conveying it in to a handle design.

 

And as far as the first one flowing, I literally just flipped the blade shape and turned it in to a handle.

 

In other news, the government called today, I have an interview next week for a small business grant (NOT loan! :D). If all goes well, I could be up and running by June.

 

How does this look?

 

The grant opportunity is GREAT!!!! Regarding the fighter, in my humble opinion, I would either use the larger side of the guard on both sides and face it in the opposite direction or, my personal preference would be to make a much smaller round or oval guard and contour the handle for solid finger grips. Sorry if that is more of an opinion than you were looking for but I think that would look cool as well. GOOD LUCK with the interview.

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Hello

 

I really don't give advice very often on what to do. But I started about the same way you did. I tried to learn by myself to learn knife making for 3-4 years all by my self and I thought i WAS DOING WELL. until I went to a real class in knife making the teachers be very kind told me the best thing I could do was going to class and at the end of only 2 weeks of classes at the ABS school and 1 other teacher. I unlearned and learned so much you would think that 2 different people made the knives if you looked at my knifes 2 weeks apart. So what I am saying is you can save more money by taking classes and learning how to set up your shop and how to use all the tools you will need to make knives.

 

I spent over 1.5k in tools when I first started out if I had gone to the class first the tools would have been a lot less and not so abused. also I would have made better knives that I could sell for more money. Example the first three years I could only sell my stuff for 35-45 and real good one 60. after classes that went up to 135-175. I worked in the shop from when the teachers first opened the doors until they put a boot in my ass to kick me out for the night. a the end of the 2 week I got a lot of knives forged and sold every one of them. so in the end the class paid for itself. in in truth if I had paid 20 times what the class taught me it was a steel.

 

You should let your desire to learn take precedent over buying tools, read all you can talk to every one you can TAKE THE CLASSES then and only start buying tools and the only ones you need.

 

Bill Jones

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Cowbone: Excellent. Petsmart or butcher shop!

Grant: Yeah... no. Did not get it. Surprisingly not because I told them I want to make knives.

Bill: I already have most of the tools I need for making stuff. I started construction of the furnace today, and should finish within the week.

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Kurt,

 

IMHO, you learn ten time more by doing than by intending to do.

 

Jump in the fray and make a knife. Design is wonderful, but it needs to be informed by the experience of making to be meaningful.

 

Make a knife. It doesn't matter how bad it sucks. The experience of making will teach you more than anything else.

 

Having said that, there are two books I recommend: #1: Step-by-Step Knifemaking by David Boye. This is a really good book on stock removal making (skills which everyone needs). #2: The Complete Bladesmith, by Jim Hrisoulas (on how to forge blades).

 

Honestly, you don't need anything but basic equipment, these two books and a lot of time in the shop to practice.

 

Here's a secret that is not often articulated: There is a conversation between the bladesmith and his materials. You can only enter that conversation by entering the fray and actually crafting a blade. All we do on this forum is tell others about the conversations we are having with our various projects. You can learn some by talking to us, but you will learn vastly more by starting your own conversation with steel.

 

Cheers,

 

--Dave

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There is a conversation between the bladesmith and his materials. You can only enter that conversation by entering the fray and actually crafting a blade. All we do on this forum is tell others about the conversations we are having with our various projects.

 

Dave,

 

I like that idea very much. What you didn't say is that sometimes you need to listen to what the project is saying. It's not always possible, or even the best, to impose your own thoughts, often the steel knows what is best.

 

Geoff

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sometimes you need to listen to what the project is saying. It's not always possible, or even the best, to impose your own thoughts, often the steel knows what is best.

 

Geoff

Boy, that sure is true. "Listening" to the materials and moving them in the way they "want" to move is an important part of the conversation.

 

This is probably the biggest learning curve I went through. I had an idea of how something would react to a given technique. When the reality didn't match up with the vision in my head, I kept trying to force it. Adapting technique to the natural flow of the material and equipment is something I still strive for.

 

Dude. We've totally gone Zen here. I'm going out to light incense by the forge now . . . LOL

 

--Dave

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Soon I'll have a forge to light incense by. I got a bunch of ceramic wool lining and a few fire bricks today. This thing's on its way!

 

I had a few more design ideas, but I'm at a complete loss as far as the handle design for this one:

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Edited by Kurt

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Soon I'll have a forge to light incense by. I got a bunch of ceramic wool lining and a few fire bricks today. This thing's on its way!

 

I had a few more design ideas, but I'm at a complete loss as far as the handle design for this one:

 

I'll call that a "tanto-chete", and I say it needs a handle wrap of some kind, if that's any help? Maybe leather?

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Soon I'll have a forge to light incense by. I got a bunch of ceramic wool lining and a few fire bricks today. This thing's on its way!

 

Just a side note. Make sure you have some refractory cement to coat that inswool in. After it hits 1700F or so it starts throwing off tiny, nasty ceramic particles that will get stuck in your lungs and cause silicosis with extended exposure...

 

-d

Edited by deker

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Oy. That sounds kind of important. I haven't noticed anything coming out of the furnace yet, though.

 

Here's one more. Anyone have tips on how to get the brass rings (bent from wire) on and have them stay on?

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Aaaaaand another, inspired by that one in the smithsonian I like. Pictured is the wood I'd use. This one obviously isn't going to be one of my first.

 

Remember: Abuse me. I'd rather I get told how much I suck at the design stage then when I reveal the finished result. Anything. Balance concerns, blade shape, handle size, blade size, anything.

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Edited by Kurt

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Aaaaaand another, inspired by that one in the smithsonian I like. Pictured is the wood I'd use. This one obviously isn't going to be one of my first.

 

Remember: Abuse me. I'd rather I get told how much I suck at the design stage then when I reveal the finished result. Anything. Balance concerns, blade shape, handle size, blade size, anything.

 

 

I would definitely wait a while before trying this one. Get some good experience first on simpler shapes. That thing pictured has some serious compound curves that are going to be real fun whether you are forging or stock removal. Oh, and sharpening is going to be a real pain as well. ;)

 

Interesting design though.

Edited by MrBaz

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Thar. I experimented a little with the machete (a strip of rosewood or steel along the side through the pins, wood burning, etc.) but it all circled back to three pins. The handle is going to be ebony, I think.

 

Stay tuned for more in the next day or two.

 

How hard is it to grind a dagger evenly?

 

 

I think the second one would make a better chopper. It has a little more mass right where it counts.

 

Grinding a dagger evenly? You'll get varying answers, but it isn't too hard. Just go slow and remove as little metal as possible. Don't get excited about it and move too fast. You'll end up making mistakes too fast as well.

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