Ito Matsumoto Posted May 12, 2013 Share Posted May 12, 2013 Hi! Did a spear. Now I think: how to attach the wings to it? http://itomatsu.ru/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Van Krevelen Posted May 12, 2013 Share Posted May 12, 2013 a forge weld would be very difficault, I would mig it if your not going for %100 period. If you are going to try a forge weld I would start from a thick peice of square stock (3/4 or 1 in), weld then draw out the wings. I am no expert, just an idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ito Matsumoto Posted May 12, 2013 Author Share Posted May 12, 2013 saw off in tube... cut and saw off in tube... ??????? http://itomatsu.ru/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petr Florianek Posted May 12, 2013 Share Posted May 12, 2013 braze them with brass, i heard some originals were made that way GULLINBURSTI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raymond Jewell Posted May 12, 2013 Share Posted May 12, 2013 Honestly, in my opinion, simple is beautiful and believe me when i say that you have already fulfilled both requirements. I would say mount it and go with that. I have a funny feeling that if you put on wings, it will take away from the beauty of the spear. But again, that is just my opinion. Great work so far and keep it up. “Fire and air, earth and water, were once considered the four elemental substances of our world. Among the ancients only the blacksmith worked with all four.” - From The Art of Blacksmithing by Alex W. Bealer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Labros Papageorgiou Posted May 12, 2013 Share Posted May 12, 2013 I love that your mark is on a little spot of bronze! very nice touch. As I was seeing this I wondered. Lets say I make a blade, on that I engrave ,fairly deeply, some ornaments, then pure motlen bronze on top of the blade and I grind it once again....would I eventually have a blade with bronze inlays ???? o.O www.EmbersFly.com facebook.com/EmbersFly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petr Florianek Posted May 12, 2013 Share Posted May 12, 2013 you would, but then you would have to do the heat treat with the bronze on. and once you manage to have a super nice engrave, the inlay is not that hard to do, bronze being one of the worse. ask Jeff H. about bronze inlays GULLINBURSTI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasperDielemans Posted May 12, 2013 Share Posted May 12, 2013 I'm with Raymond. I too think it has a great element of simplicity and cleanness that would be nice to retain. http://www.jrd-artistry.deviantart.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ondřej Borský Posted May 12, 2013 Share Posted May 12, 2013 Well the thing is, what is Ito recreating? If he wants do make a frankish spear, these were frequently winged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Longmire Posted May 12, 2013 Share Posted May 12, 2013 Beautiful, Ito. As Petr said, we had a discussion about that a long time ago and determined that some were brazed and some were welded during construction of the socket. I like your idea, but I suspect it would be difficult to make it tight enough. I could be wrong, of course! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Thomas Obach Posted May 12, 2013 Share Posted May 12, 2013 hi Ito i face this exact problem right now... and can come up with only complex answers ( which is suspect are wrong ) who would figure out that Wings would be so difficult to put on spear ( ofcourse without arc welding, which in my opinion would spoil the flavour of the spear ! ) good luck, you alway make such nice spears ! Greg North Shore Forge & Ironworks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theodore An. Posted May 12, 2013 Share Posted May 12, 2013 (edited) Just an idea Ito... Wrap around the cone of the spear two new bar stocks and forge weld them... I hope you get the idea... After forge welding,grind the winds to any shape you like... Edited May 12, 2013 by Theodore An. http://www.facebook.com/groups/205149489611061/ http://www.greekblades.com/index.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Colwell Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 braze them. that is the way to go. beautiful work, too. please visit my website http://www.professorsforge.com/ “Years ago I recognized my kinship with all living things, and I made up my mind that I was not one bit better than the meanest on the earth. I said then and I say now, that while there is a lower class, I am in it; while there is a criminal element, I am of it; while there is a soul in prison, I am not free.” E. V. Debs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ito Matsumoto Posted May 13, 2013 Author Share Posted May 13, 2013 Thank you, guys! I think riveted wings does not work, weld too late. I'll leave this tip so ... Next spearhead do with wings, and I'm prepared for it in advance. Once again, thank you, friends, for your sympathy ... http://itomatsu.ru/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Yates Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 I think you have made a wise choice Ito . it looks Awesome as it is . Sam Robert D. Yates , 13 & On Forge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Parkinson Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 I did one of these a number of years ago. I had the same problem figuring out the attachment of the wings. I found three main method 1st and most common, forge welded on. from what I can tell they are welded on after the socket is formed, sort of a T shaped cross section that is then blended into the socket, this is one of those welds that is darn near imposable in modern steels but is very doable in the very low carbon bloomery iron of the time. the second method is the copper/ bronze/ Brass braze (also called a penny weld) this also includes some of the bronze cast sockets, 3rd the two wings are one piece that passes through the socket and are riveted or brazed in place, I only found one done this way in the viking era, but this method is more common in later time periods. At the time I ended up using the third method, if I was to make another I would silver braze the wings into fitted mortises.MP Web site http://www.dragonsbreathforge.com Insagram account http://instagram.com/swordmatt# Blog http://mpmetal.tumblr.com/ Facebook https://www.facebook/dragonsbreathforge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J. Helmes Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 You should braze them on. It would be plenty strong and look awesome http://www.jeffhelmes.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Stephens Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 This may be too modern a solution to capture the period feel, but if you don't feel like brazing, you could consider slotting. Make the wings slightly larger until the base of the wing matches the base of the socket. Cut a slot the same thickness of the wing 1/2 the width of the wing into the socket, and a matching slot into the socket itself. Slide the two together until they interlock and cement in place with low temperature silver solder. With that much mechanical connection, the shear strength of the solder (which isn't too bad actually) should be sufficient. This method would also have the advantage of creating two small slits of metal within the socket that, if the spear pole were slotted to accept, would prevent spinning. Anyway, just a thought. Luck! Dave -----------------------------------------------"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly; who errs and comes short again and again; because there is not effort without error and shortcomings; but who does actually strive to do the deed; who knows the great enthusiasm, the great devotion, who spends himself in a worthy cause, who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement and who at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly." -- Theodore Roosevelthttp://stephensforge.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Yates Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 (edited) ITO, If you so choose to add them you could slot the Cone ,Dove tail the wings , and silver solder them in I can send you 2 rods of Silver Solder rods it is ; (Silvaloy 5 ) "The Contractors Choice" (AWS BCuP-3) (.050X1/8). You can look at it Here : http://www.silvaloy.com/cuphos.php It is the 9 Th one on the chart and has the Spec's for its use . Sam Edited May 14, 2013 by Samcro Robert D. Yates , 13 & On Forge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ito Matsumoto Posted May 14, 2013 Author Share Posted May 14, 2013 This spear will now remain so ... Thanks for the advice, my friends ... Take the next spear with wings, already cooked yesterday and the core tube "snakes." http://itomatsu.ru/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ito Matsumoto Posted May 14, 2013 Author Share Posted May 14, 2013 Sam, thank you for the offer, but silver solder I have. I would love to get steel W2 - there are a couple of projects with this steel. Can you help me? I can buy, how to pay ... If you can - then let's talk in a personal message. http://itomatsu.ru/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GEzell Posted May 16, 2013 Share Posted May 16, 2013 Sam, thank you for the offer, but silver solder I have. I would love to get steel W2 - there are a couple of projects with this steel. Can you help me? I can buy, how to pay ... If you can - then let's talk in a personal message. I know Aldo (new jersey steel baron) will ship just about anywhere, and has it in stock.... Awesome work sir! George Ezell, bladesmith" How much useful knowledge is lost by the scattered forms in which it is ushered to the world! How many solitary students spend half their lives in making discoveries which had been perfected a century before their time, for want of a condensed exhibition of what is known."Buffonview some of my work RelicForge on facebook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Yates Posted May 16, 2013 Share Posted May 16, 2013 ITO , I will be at a Friends today what size do you need PM me and let me know & with an Addy . Sam Robert D. Yates , 13 & On Forge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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