Jump to content

survival dagger/ throwing knife


Guest guest T

Recommended Posts

Guest guest T

First off I would like to thank the bladesmithing community a a whole, not only on this forum but also in real life for how welcoming you all are to new people.

yesterday I went to the 2013 Idaho Knife Association where someone there let me use their tools and propane forge for 2 hours. I did about 90% of the forging. this is the first knife I started and finished in one day (if you can count 1 am as the same day). both edges are very sharp but the only the first 2 inches on the top are sharpened. knife #4 finished

1400751_543764852360006_106527322_o.jpg

 

and here is my third knife if you care to see it.

 

858534_542302355839589_1445294922_o.jpg

Link to post
Share on other sites

Tre,

 

Has anyone shown you how to draw file? If not, try this. Clamp your piece to a chunk of 2 x 4, it tends to flex otherwise. It's best to clean most of the forge scale off first. I use an angle grinder. You're just trying to get most of the big scale, not down to a clean surface.

 

Hold the handle of a bastard file (12-16 inch coarse file) in one hand and the other end in the other hand. Lay the file on the piece and pull toward yourself. It will skate at first, but after a few passes it will really start to bite. After a couple of strokes move an inch or so up the file. When you reach the end of the file, knock the fragments off and start over. This prevents the little curls of steel from galling and making grooves in the steel. I use a glove, like a bike glove, on the off hand, the file tends to bite into your hand. You can surface a blade pretty fast this way. You can't use this on hard steel, but on normalized steel, it works great.

 

Geoff

Link to post
Share on other sites

Yep geoff's right, wear a glove! I've got a heck of a calus on my left palm!!! Draw filing works, I made a wood file, handles on both sides, leather strip one one flat, then use emery belt, 60 , 120 grit as if you are draw fileing, from there I go to 220, 400, 600 etc.then it becomes polishing!!!

Link to post
Share on other sites

Good start is right! A little rough, but No. 1, are they sharp? and No. 2 do the hold an edge reasonably well in use? That is the foundation of good work. Don't go for fancy in finish or materials before you have mastered No. 1 and No. 2.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest T

this knife is my sharpest yet and they all seem to hold an edge well. I did try draw filing on the last few thousands of an inch and it did work but I dont have the patience to sand out the file marks by hand. as it is filing and sanding took over 4 hours. the bevel on the cutting edge is about 20 degrees and the back twce that.

edit: I forgot to say that I file the bevels on my knives completely by hand.

Edited by Tre Asay
Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest T

unfortunatly the blade snapped after a few throws. perhaps water it too agresive for hardening 5160, well I will try again when I get some blade steel.

Link to post
Share on other sites

unfortunatly the blade snapped after a few throws. perhaps water it too agresive for hardening 5160, well I will try again when I get some blade steel.

 

Did you temper?

Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest T

Did you temper?

I normalized to black from critical 4 times, quenched in water at critical, then tempered at 470 f (243 C)for 1 hour. here is a close up on the break:

1404700_545022165567608_1988387957_o.jpg

Link to post
Share on other sites

Tre, I know it seems like a long time, doing things by hand, but don't be afraid to take your time and enjoy the craft. There is a type of meditation called.process meditation, and essentially it it drowning out the noise of the world by focusing on a seemingly benign task. Mr. Fogg describes this very well in his interview from Arctic Fire, and I believe he also mentions this on his website. I know this may seem like an unneeded skill, since you are still young, but as you get older, drowning out the world gets harder and harder.

Link to post
Share on other sites

From what I understand about 5160 water can be a bit too stressful, add to it the tempering cycle. I normally give it a couple rounds of tempering at 2 hours a round. I go s step further in the hard users by drawing back the temper in the spine to spring colour. There are alot of memebers here who have much more experience than myself. Do a bit of searching in the archives and I'm pretty sure you'll find some more about how people deal with the 5160.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Correct me if I am wrong, but his knife did survive the quench, so I would assume the water was not stressful enough, unless the crack formed without notice.

 

For future reference when quenching in water, I would take it straight to the oven to temper, and leave it there for 2 hours. Take it out, let it cool, and then another 2 hours at a slightly higher temper, maybe 20 degrees hotter. 1 hour of temper doesn't sound to be long enough, especially as far as you need to go for a knife that is being thrown.

 

I am not a professional by any means, but have had a year now to work out a few kinks.

Link to post
Share on other sites

1. your grain size seems pretty big - you got it too hot either in normalising or before the quench.

 

2. 5160 really does not like water - either get a water quench steel or some oil for quenching.

 

3. a throwing knife takes a huge amount of force. most are unhardened, but if you are going to harden so it also functions as a knife, it needs to be at a full spring temper -500f - 550f.

 

patience is a virtue - it's worth doing some more reading and learning to do this stuff right. bad habits are hard to break.

 

the good news is that your shaping looks clean and even, which will stand you in good stead in the future.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I must agre with Jake! Patience and knowing the steel you're working with will help. I live in a pretty backwards place, when I ask what the steels made of, ( percentage carbon, nickle , etc.) They look at me as If I'm nuts! You can get charts for h-treating any type of steel if you know what it is. I experiment with small pieces 'till I get it right! Then document results so I don't mess up 'till I run out of stock! Then start all over again with new stock! If it's worth doing, it's worth doing well! And from what I've seen, your work is worth doing...

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...