Jump to content
MSchneider

80CRV2 problem

Recommended Posts

I picked up a bar of 80CRV2 from Aldo and I'm having trouble getting it to really harden. I have tried a couple of times now and I am just not getting decent results. I have heat treated a bunch of 5160 (which this should be similar to) and never had and trouble, but this is just not performing like I expected.

 

So far I have tried:

 

Attempt 1:

after normalization I austenitized at 1590F for 15 minutes and then quenched into 120F 11 second oil. Seemed soft as quenched. It was hard but still filed pretty easily. I filed quite a bit to make sure I got through any decarb but still no go.

 

Attempt 2:

After normalization I austenitized at 1610F for 20 minutes and quenched into 140F 11 second oil. Same results as above.

 

 

The edge thickness of the piece is heavier than I normally go but still reasonable. (about 1/8") Just in case my temp was off I did check to make sure it is non-magnetic. Am I missing something? I've never had this kind of trouble with 5160 and I have even used this oil with good results on 1084 so it should be plenty fast. Ideas??

 

Thanks,

Mark

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

no experience with this steel, but it's worth noting that checking for non magnetic just tells you you're above the Curie point (1418f). 5160 would seem to austenitise 50f-100f cooler than 80crv2, so could be a calibration issue. bump the temp up 50f and try again...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mark,

 

I've not used this steel as I'm not much for trying the latest "Steel de Jour" but here's what I understand from some that have: Austenize in the 1515-1575 range and quench in a medium oil like AAA. The vanadium should help with grain size. If you use the lower end of the austenizing temps then you will keep more of the carbon above .6% in carbide form. Once you have the desired hardness after quenching then start your tempering with 350 degrees and work your way up from there until you get the desired hardness.

 

I'm always hesitant to try new steels as it requires so much testing to get satisfactory results. I'm not saying that experimenting is a bad thing. Quite the contrary. You just need to be willing to put in the time to get the wanted results. ;) I've got a pile of unsatisfactory blades under my forge to remind me that not everything is worthy to go out the door.

 

Gary

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

are you sure you didn't get some decarb from the longish soaks? iI have been hardening from 1575 with out any issues.

MP

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the advice everyone. I don't mind putting in the time to test and dial in a new steel, this is just confusing as it is not performing as logic says it should. The process should be very similar to 5160 which I am very familiar with. Going off the specs if you use a set recipe you should get at least acceptable results. It could be calibration on my kiln, so I will give a higher temp a try. It could also be decarb, but even at a 20 minute soak I would think the decarb should only be a few hundredths of an inch?

 

Maybe I will make up a batch of test samples and try them each at various temps and soaks. It just seemed odd to me that the same process with 5160at 50 deg lower, yields a great result, when this is such a similar alloy.

 

Oh well...if it was easy then it wouldn't be fun right? :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mr Schneider, I have used this steel fairly often in my shop. I love it, great tough steel with very good edge stability and retention. It has been called by a few different names, 1080+ being one of them. And that is how I see this steel. It is basically 1080 with slightly less Mn, but added Cr and V. Some formulations of 80CrV2 show a couple points of Nickel as well, although Aldo's formula and Chuck's formula do not show Ni in this batch.

 

My recommendation when normalizing is 1650F for a 5 minutes soak. Then further cycle at subsequent lower temps, as in 1550F for 5 minutes and then 1450F for 5 minutes. You CAN quench on the 1550 and 1450 cycles if you like, but I would hesitate quenching on the initial normalizing heat of 1650F. Just air cool on that cycle. Or air cool on every cycle....that's your call.

 

My guess is one of two things....your kiln temps are off. Or more than likely, you have a massive layer of decarb due to the extended soaks at the temps you mentioned. Which, by the way, are really too high for this steel. You mentioned you filed into it a ways and did not hit hard steel, but maybe not deep enough?

 

This steel hardens very well for sure. I like to put just enough carbon into solution for full hardness, and leave the rest for carbide formers as Mr Mulkey mentioned. Which, of course, at slightly above the eutectoid point will not form a whole bunch of primary carbides, but there is excess carbon and carbide forming elements in the mix, so.......

 

What that translates to is an austentizing temperature of around 1475F, with a solid soak of 10 minutes, and quenching into a medium/medium fast oil. I was thinking due to the slightly reduced Mn content of this steel that it would need a faster oil than 11 second, but there is Cr that definitely swings things back the other direction. I've used 130F canola oil with excellent results. Have not tried commercial 11 second oil myself.

 

I am amazed at hust how much decarb there is on the surface of hardened steel. Just a couple days ago I did a couple of knives, 52100 and W2, following the steps mentioned above. Once quenched, I usually do a file skate test to tell me if it hardened at least. And when you put the file to steel, it acts like mild steel! And after digging in with the file, and digging, and digging, I wonder to myself "Did this even harden at all???" And then all of a sudden I feel and hear the change in steel hardness. And see it, too. Hardened steel under the decarb layer stands out. And then I have to grind off the decarb layer, which is easy to do because you can actually see that transition line, and chase it all the way up and off of the spine. (Would LOVE to get my hands on anti-scale/anti-decarb stuff!!!!).

 

Verify your temps, minimize decarb if you can with PCB or ATP or whatever is used, and lower your hardening temp. Should be screaming hard out of quench! Good luck, my friend. Let us know how it turns out!!! Would love to hear your successful heat treat on this 80CrV2!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×