What did you do in your shop today?

[Aiden CC]

I’ve been working in a handful of pieces based on originals described in Puukkon Historia, and that involved my first successful hat-sheath (turns out fourth time was the charm). You really do need to make a wooden model of the knife to stitch around, I couldn’t get it to work until I did. 
 

[Kreg Whitehead]

I debated weather or not this was the spot for this.....but what I have been doing for the last 4 hours(today) is trying to heat treat some stainless blades.

I have a paragon with a 3.0 sentry controller.

It was throwing me an LAG code. A PF1 and a PF2 code. Now I am just getting the pf 2 code mostly.

The manual says after that it needs to be above 72 to fire again after a power failure and I was only at 70 according to the unit.

I fixed the inside temp.....and have no clue when or how I had a power failure...and still notta.

I have tried the reset function.....and I still have the 2 firing programs I put in....so I assume that isnt working.

I tried the 2 min test  and test fire function and after 30 seconds or so I get a AOP2 code.

That says is some special outlet or something I dont even have.....and wont fire at all.

I am guessing its the whole controller or something not simple.

Not one of my happier investments if thats the case......right now I am probably at the 100 dollar a blade mark on heat treating not counting foil or power.

Spent all day yesterday beating my head against a wall with a weed wacker that wont run.

Would have been a nice day to play blades. I have 15 dollars worth of dry ice going to waste in the freezer.

Any thoughts or suggestions would be awesome....feel free to move this if this isnt the spot.

Edit.....if all else fails I will re type it in tools.

I have already emaild paragons ask a tech dealio.

Had these 3 ready and a hunter thats in foil.

 

Edited June 11 by Kreg Whitehead

[Alan Longmire]

I think it should be in tools, and dang, I hope someone can help! 

But I can't move it, sorry.

[billyO]

3 hours ago, Kreg Whitehead said:

I debated weather or not this was the spot for this.....but what I have been doing for the last 4 hours(today) is trying to heat treat some stainless blades.

I have a paragon with a 3.0 sentry controller.

It was throwing me an LAG code. A PF1 and a PF2 code. Now I am just getting the pf 2 code mostly.

The manual says after that it needs to be above 72 to fire again after a power failure and I was only at 70 according to the unit...

 

Not sure if this will help, but the Paragon that we have in our shop has always thrown us something like a temp lag (I can't remember exactly what it says). 

 

What happens is we set the program, start it, and it starts to heat up, so I walk away, and after a little bit I hear the alarm beeping with the LAG code, and so I go back and re-start the program at that point and it runs as normal.

 

[Joshua States]

On 6/8/2023 at 11:34 PM, Gerhard Gerber said:

One big question remains, do I come in from the top or the side of the burner..... 

All of the ribbon burners I have made follow the Emmerling model and the gas/air tube comes in directly behind the ceramic burner perpendicular to the burner. 

 

 

 

 

 

15 hours ago, Kreg Whitehead said:

Any thoughts or suggestions would be awesome....

One of the things I remember about the Paragon oven is it will not begin firing a program if the furnace temp is less than 100*C below the target F1 temp. Have you tried the basic reboot? Unplug it, spin around 3 times, and plug it back in.

[billyO]

On 6/8/2023 at 11:34 PM, Gerhard Gerber said:

One big question remains, do I come in from the top or the side of the burner..... 

 

23 minutes ago, Joshua States said:

All of the ribbon burners I have made follow the Emmerling model and the gas/air tube comes in directly behind the ceramic burner perpendicular to the burner. 

Same here.  However, at risk of stirring the pot, 3 weeks ago at the NWBA annual spring conference, Jeffrey Funk gave a seminar on forge building based on his 40+ years of experience and he builds his forges with the ribbon burner on the floor with a parabolic shaped interior of the forge so that he gets a 'swirling' effect similar to what Dave Lisch and others suggest with venturi burners.  Jeff casts a little damn around the burner (and it is cast off to the side of the forge) to prevent flux and other stuff falling into the burner.   (I'm probably not going to do this on the new forge I'm about to build for our shop, however)

Another thing that he suggests (that I am designing into our new forge) is making doors on pulleys (like a garage door) using cast refractory so that you only have to open the forge enough to get stuff in and out and not have a perpetually open hole where heat can escape the forge when the opening is just stacked bricks.  He does this by making the face of the forge at 5 degree angle off square so that gravity keeps the doors flush against the face of the forge. 

[Alan Longmire]

15 minutes ago, billyO said:

ribbon burner on the floor with a parabolic shaped interior of the forge so that he gets a 'swirling' effect similar to what Dave Lisch and others suggest with venturi burners. 

 

I first heard that proposed in the late 1990s by a guy on keenjunk.com named Rich Waugh, went by the handle Vicopper.  He actually built said forge and it worked great.  His ribbon burner was a long thin one that ran the length of the forge. 

[Joshua States]

I think it is more than possible, in fact almost guaranteed, that forge design can be over-thought, over engineered, and complicated needlessly. Too many times I have seen modifications to a basic design that seem to me to be solutions in search of a problem.

 

There is a general acceptance that the "swirling effect" is absolutely required for efficient forge design. My response is "show me the test and comparison data". If you look at that photo of my welding forge above, you will see a 12" x 3" ribbon burner in a 16" long forge with an interior diameter of about 8". The burner is located in the center, pointed straight down. Most folks say this causes a "hot spot" directly under the burner and I'm risking burning my steel. Seems logical right?

My short answer is it doesn't work that way. The long answer is it works quite the opposite, especially at lower than welding temps. For some weird reason unknown to me, the center of this forge runs colder than the sides. When I tried cocking the burner off plumb, I got a cold spot on the other side of the billet, uneven heat, and a buggered weld.

I have tried to photograph the cold spot, but it's very difficult to get a good pic Here is the best one I have.

 

 

I have this forge set up so I can run it at 1900 F and 2000 F for general foging of the steels I generall use and with a click of a ball valve, jump up to welding heat. At welding heat, the sides of the billet generally tend to come up faster and reach welding temp before the entire top does. I know this because I still use some flux in my forge welding of PW billets. I can see the sides sweating and bubbling before the top does. This is impossible to photograph.

 

 

Edited June 12 by Joshua States

[Alan Longmire]

1 hour ago, Joshua States said:

I think it is more than possible, in fact almost guaranteed, that forge design can be over-thought, over engineered, and complicated needlessly.

I am certainly guilty of this. 

 

Ribbon burners and other forced air burners (and really oversized venturi burners) can have that cold spot effect.  That's because of the extra air it takes to keep the burner running right.  It's not oxidizing, it's just volume of moving gas that's not quite fully combusted.  In my little two-brick forge I have a comically oversized 3/4" sidearm burner that makes a cold spot on the wall it's pointed at while the rest is at welding heat.  

 

I prefer the swirl on ordinary burners, but I agree that with a ribbon it doesn't really matter.  Those just dump so much heat you can point them anywhere in the forge except straight out the door and they work fine.

 

The abovementioned Rich's forge even had a built-in air curtain across the front door and a molded floor with a drain hole in one corner for excess flux.  A fine example of the Rolls effect: That is, a Rolls Royce can't do anything a cheaper car can do just as well, except impress random strangers.

 

I think Jeff Pringle's nuclear marshmallow crucible furnace is the perfect opposite to this.  Just a roll of kaowool, some binding wire, and the simplest blown burner ever (literally some 1/4" copper tube plugged into a 1" black iron pipe, no valves, just a damper on the blower and a regulator on the gas tank).  It gives you molten steel in about half an hour, and when it cools off you just take the wire loose, roll up the wool, and stick it in the corner until next time.

 

[Gerald Boggs]

10 hours ago, Alan Longmire said:

Rich Waugh,

I remember him, he used to moderate an art metal forum.  Sadly the forum is no more, it was owned by a NC smith long retired.  Anyway, that was a very cool forge.   I liked the little vertical burner on the side that allowed one to heat up just a little area, looked great for working small bits.

Edited June 13 by Gerald Boggs

[Kreg Whitehead]

On 6/12/2023 at 6:31 AM, Joshua States said:

All of the ribbon burners I have made follow the Emmerling model and the gas/air tube comes in directly behind the ceramic burner perpendicular to the burner. 

 

 

 

 

 

One of the things I remember about the Paragon oven is it will not begin firing a program if the furnace temp is less than 100*C below the target F1 temp. Have you tried the basic reboot? Unplug it, spin around 3 times, and plug it back in.

Long story short....after talking to the tech line with a multi meter and the back and controls out of the front....I was getting zero power to the relay.

The girl says looks like your mother board is bad.

I say what is the least expensive on there is?

She says the one you have....its 550.00 .

I called Jantz the next day. She says it has either a 2 or 2.5 year warrantee and you bought it in July of 2021.

Sooooo that was a relief until I called paragon the next day.

He chuckles and said I dont know why they told ya that...the warrantee period is one year.

What controller is it he says. I tell him sentry 3.0.

He says oh ....we dont even use those anymore...I have one on the shelf I will give ya.

I shipped the old one off this morning.

Hopefully I will have it back together soon.

I paid close to 2 k and have done less than 20 blades.

So far not my best investment. ....guess I will hope and see if the new one lasts longer.

 

[Jaro Petrina]

[Jaro Petrina]

Screwed up the eye a bit (after I punched it perfectly on the press, as I didnt had the mandrel and made one afterwards. Water quench. The chap wanted me to grind it clean.  Also to run my forge and forge by hand is like burning euros these days    Next time better.

[Jaro Petrina]

[Jaro Petrina]

This is how it looks hafted.

[Alan Longmire]

I like the folding brass edge cover. 

 

I was feeling masochistic, so I inlaid a silver nameplate and a silver knife into the iron hawk head. My shoulders are not happy...

 

 

 

Gonna have to regrind two of my O1 die sinkers' chisels after that. 

[Alan Longmire]

Added a diamond on the other side, and engraved the nameplate.

 

 

 

Turns out Tod was right; the trick to making it look authentic is to do it badly... 

[Don Abbott]

Got a request for a branding iron a couple weeks back:

 

 

 

This was a unique request. The letters are only around 1.5" tall.

 

It is for branding steaks and other meats for a photo shoot for one of those "farm to table" restaurants.

 

I cut the letters on the band saw and cleaned them up with the grinder and needle files.

 

The handle was brazed on.

 

Apparently the customer liked it.

[Alan Longmire]

Nice!

[Alan Longmire]

Spent the last couple of weekend trying to develop the patina I was after.  I'm getting close...

 

 

A long soak in ferric chloride enriched with white vinegar to open the grain, followed by cold bluing and polishing back to 600 grit.  Those aren't scratches, that's the grain of the too-clean wrought I used. Looks much better in person, more like an antique.

[Alan Longmire]

Started work on the handle today.  First I fitted the head, then carved the grooves for the cast pewter bands.

 

 

Made the carboard and tape forms, cast the pewter:

 

 

Let it cool a bit, then peeled off the forms:

 

 

Cleaned it up and reset the head.

 

 

And the patina on the head is still looking good...

 

 

I plan on putting a hunter's star inlay, or maybe a diamond shaped inlay, between the pewter bands, but my wife thinks I should let the wood speak for itself.  It's pretty nice curly maple. It will have a modestly fancy cast pewter mouthpiece.  What do y'all think? Inlays or no?

[Kreg Whitehead]

The tendonitis has put a dampener on any heat and beat for me lately.

Yesterday I couldnt take it anymore and figured out with this set up I can use 2 hands and a sledge.

It is/was a can with 1084 and some partially un wound cable.

[Alan Longmire]

Today I did the mouthpiece.

 

Channels carved out.  Note the layout lines, which get ignored pretty quickly once carving starts:

 

 

Rotated to show depth, and the stainless tubing with grooves, pre-tinned to lock it to the pewter.  

 

 

Poured:

 

 

Cleaned up to a 400 grit belt finish.

 

 

So nobody has any input on whether or not I should add more inlays?

[Kreg Whitehead]

Thats pretty dang kewl.....and amazing to me at least the wood didnt get burnt on the edge where it met the molten metal.

[Jaron Martindale]

1 hour ago, Alan Longmire said:

So nobody has any input on whether or not I should add more inlays?

With the addition of that beautiful mouth piece I say no more inlay.  I think it gives it a nice balanced feel, not too busy up top.