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Matt Walker

Kinyon, Air Demand Calculations

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I built my 1st old style Kinyon hammer around 20 years ago and it has just worked with out complaint. Recently a friend offered me one he built a few years ago, it wound up at my shop. No such thing as too many hammers right. Basic problems were the guides were a little tight and the hydraulic cylinder he used had too much resistance, changed the ring for an easier moving one and got everything lined up good. Biggest issue was the muffler was restricting exhaust. Before removing muffler https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H1zy6s9hlXc after removing muffler https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHqgOGprlS0

 

The question now is how to calculate the air demand? Right now it's set up temporarily without the best air supply and too far from forges. But there is a 60 gallon reserve tank sitting right beside the hammer and supply with a 1/2 inch line to the hammer. In these actual forging test just over a minute you can see things start to get slower and I finally just give up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNQbf08Z-GY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8ieraYTCDg

 

Based on 120, 10 inch, strokes per minute, a 2.5 inch cylinder with a 1.25 inch rod, I'm calculating 5.5 to 6 cubic feet per minute. The reserve tank (8 cubic feet) is being resupplied with only a 3/8 inch line. At the end of the forging video you can hear the air rushing in to refill the reserve tank. My compressor is supposed to do 23 cfm @ 175 Am I missing something in my math? Just trying to plan for a sufficient air supply in it's final resting place. Looks like if I can get enough air to it, it will hit hard and fast enough to keep the work hot for a while. How big a line do you think I would need to get rid of the reserve tank or locate it outside? I think I'm getting the volume and stroke numbers close but I don't know how to figure how much air can be moved in a given length and diameter line at a given pressure?

 

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Matt ,

Nice hammer. By ignoring the rod completely, I see about a 7 cfm rate of usage . I had one of these and placed a small storage tank near the hammer 90 lbs weight/3" cylinder. I rarely would run the hammer at the length of time you did in that clip.....I would always run out of high psi air using a 5 hp compressor. I am building another one by converting an old power hammer.For me 90 psi was plenty of pressure using a 3" cylinder...in California the residential power rates are high and increase exponentially with higher usage quantities. I have a Chambersburg 200 sitting in my yard to be moved ( sold) this Wednesday..

Anvil to head weight was always an issue for me it was about 12/1, very noisy. The power hammer conversion will be about 24/1 ( 50Lbs head ) I have a large diameter shaft begging for some attention, it would be 45/1 , 100 lbs head. I called the big Blue Hammer makers recently, regarding cylinder sizing..very helpful .

 

 

Jan

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Thanks Jan,

Helpful to know I'm close on how much air it is actually using. The way it emptied the 60 gallon tank I thought I was missing something. Right now I'm thinking of running 3/4 or 1 inch copper supply to the hammers when I rearrange everything in my shop to accommodate the new one.

 

Yeah, I also believe in high anvil to hammer ratio. I'll be adding weight to this anvil. Already have some 4 x 4 x 3/8 tube and working on some lead to fill the tubes with.

 

I just found this: Screen%20Shot%202016-07-03%20at%20Jul%20

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Update, Ran a 3/4 line in addition to the 1/2 line that was already there, anvil increased from apx #400 to over 1000, extensive tuning and placed closer to the forges.

Edited by Matt Walker

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Very nice. I am not sure what the tup weight is on that hammer.....for what I am doing I find the 50 - 110 range a perfect fit.

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Thanks Jan,

It's around #75, about the same as my older hammer in head weight. I just never realized going from a 2 inch cylinder to a 2.5 and better air supply would result in this much increased performance. Now I'm wondering what would happen If I put a 3 on one of them!

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The Chambersburg was a 200 # with a piston area of 20 in sq or 1/10. Using this relationship a 2.5" cylinder is matched with a 50# head and a 3" with a 70# head. I have had a 100 # head on a 3" cylinder and it worked well at high pressure ( above 60 psi. ) .

 

Jan

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Thanks for sharing that..I was waiting to hear the compressor turn on but did not hear it. It seems you have the little wheels on the valves hitting the 90 deg angle of the hammer tup...I would recommend using a little piece of sheet metal slightly bent as a gentler ramp.

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Hi Jan,

Yeah, my compressor sits outside in it's own little shed. There is a small ramp ground into the top of hammer head where it contacts the wheels. Just got this worked out last night and haven't worked hot steel with it yet. I think on first impression I'll like it better than the single pilot system I've been running.

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