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On 11/10/2017 at 12:52 PM, Joël Mercier said:

You will need mill bastard files for finitiob and drawfiling. They are very different from regular bastard ones.

Should they all be mill pattern?

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6 minutes ago, R. Thiele said:

Should they all be mill pattern?

Double cut bastard for quick stock removal and mill bastard to finish. 

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And second cut and smooth in the smaller sizes.  Mill files are parallel on the wide faces.  Flat files taper a bit, hand files have a little curve to the faces.  Pillar files are narrow relative to width.  And that's just a few of the American pattern files, all of which can work.  The reason mill files are often recommended is that parallel face thing.  That makes it easier for most people to get good results.  Plus American pattern files only come in two cuts and four (well, three, but five once upon a time ) finenesses, the cuts being double cut or single cut and the finenesses being coarse, bastard, second cut, smooth, and dead smooth.  Coarse and dead smooth no longer exist, but old ones show up from time to time.  On top of that, within a family of files, the shorter the file the finer the cut even with the same name.  A 16" mill bastard has about 12 teeth per inch.  A 6" mill bastard has around 24 teeth per inch.  It's sort of proportional.  Compare that with Swiss pattern files, which, while all double cut, come in six or eight levels of fineness.  It gets complicated, in other words.  When I get home I'll try to link some old docs about files from back when they knew and used them as a matter of course.

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2 hours ago, Joël Mercier said:

Double cut bastard for quick stock removal and mill bastard to finish. 

Mill for second and smooth as well?

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After the mill bastard on the jig, I drawfile with the same file and after that it's sandpaper.

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Guys, great feedback. I know it's all a learning process, but this helps make it a less expensive one! Thanks!

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On 11/14/2017 at 7:46 PM, Alan Longmire said:

And second cut and smooth in the smaller sizes.  Mill files are parallel on the wide faces.  Flat files taper a bit, hand files have a little curve to the faces.  Pillar files are narrow relative to width.  And that's just a few of the American pattern files, all of which can work.  The reason mill files are often recommended is that parallel face thing.  That makes it easier for most people to get good results.  Plus American pattern files only come in two cuts and four (well, three, but five once upon a time ) finenesses, the cuts being double cut or single cut and the finenesses being coarse, bastard, second cut, smooth, and dead smooth.  Coarse and dead smooth no longer exist, but old ones show up from time to time.  On top of that, within a family of files, the shorter the file the finer the cut even with the same name.  A 16" mill bastard has about 12 teeth per inch.  A 6" mill bastard has around 24 teeth per inch.  It's sort of proportional.  Compare that with Swiss pattern files, which, while all double cut, come in six or eight levels of fineness.  It gets complicated, in other words.  When I get home I'll try to link some old docs about files from back when they knew and used them as a matter of course.

Good info here. I'd love to know more about how files are classified, its much more complicated than i would expect.

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So, I'm back home and as promised here are some links!  Well, two links.  You absolutely must read the chapter on files starting on page 106 in https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=wu.89059303081;view=1up;seq=5 .  There's some other good stuff in that one as well, and you can read it online or buy it off Amazon for about $8.  It's from 1904.

The other page I have not looked at as closely, but it seems pretty good for non-mill files.  https://www.wonkeedonkeetools.co.uk/files/what-are-the-different-types-of-file/  Plus, if you're in the UK you can also buy from them.  

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5 hours ago, Joël Mercier said:

Sweet, my finitiob typo has been pinned :lol:

Typo? Why did I just pay £500 for finitiob lessons?

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Because it's so important!  Ask Owen if you don't believe me, although he is more of a power-finitiobber rather than using files.

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1 hour ago, Charles du Preez said:

Typo? Why did I just pay £500 for finitiob lessons?

Because you got fooled by finitiob marketing probably...

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Well in the true way things go for me, a week after my new Coote grinder arrived with the pulley to mate up with the the stepper pulley on a motor I have, wouldn't you know it, a very clean disassembled/parts missing, treadmill with motor and speed control fell in to my lap for the incredible price of free.

I was so fluzzled I just walked away from a finitiob project I was working on. You just can't have anything else on your mind when doing that.

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Just to clarify a little bit, do NOT use a MILL bastard file for grinding bevels on  flat bar stock. It will take ages. Like Alan said, it's good for straightening bevels that have already been forged to shape. 

Someone learned it the hard way :lol:

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8 minutes ago, Joël Mercier said:

Just to clarify a little bit, do NOT use a MILL bastard file for grinding bevels on  flat bar stock. It will take ages. Like Alan said, it's good for straightening bevels that have already been forged to shape. 

Someone learned it the hard way :lol:

Joel,  if you're ever on the Chicago area, let me know.   I'll let you try some heavy duty stock removal with my mill bastard.  Haha.  It was a free workout at least.  (Now where's my double cut bastard?)

Warner

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PS - Made a deal to buy 10ea bookmatched pieces of ironwood for  $125 including shipping.  Some nice stuff.   I haven't picked the ones I want yet...waiting for photos, but $12.50 per knife sounds reasonable for really nice wood.

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Is this worth it at all? https://www.ebay.com/itm/Belt-Grinder-2x72-BASE-PLATE-/252061240737 

 

Or is it a fake.

Edited by Conner Michaux

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33 minutes ago, Conner Michaux said:

Is this worth it at all? https://www.ebay.com/itm/Belt-Grinder-2x72-BASE-PLATE-/252061240737 

 

Or is it a fake.

You realize that is just for the black base-plate, right?  The actual grinder with motor is another listing for $730 (and doesn't include that $100 base plate).  

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Woops..I feel stupid now:mellow:

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Check out the DVD for Moe's Grinder at the DVD page  on www.WayneCoeArtistBlacksmith.com.  Build your own using off the shelf bar stock and angle iron.

Let me know if I can help you.

 

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Rehashing an old thread here but after 2 years forging I finally have enough to be able purchase a mid range setup. I too am looking at the OBM grinders and Coote as well as AMK and Ameribrade. I was just looking for some other opinions. They all have pros and cons, I also plan on getting a better forge setup at this time as well to have more welding success. Thanks for any help!

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I think people stress out a bit much, I know I do, over making decisions like this. Being philosophical about it,

do research on the models and rule out ones that have QUALITY complaints. When you see a complaint about a feature, or lack of, take the time and evaluate the complaint and how it would affect what you do right now, what you want to do better now, and what you might want to do in the future. If someone says "this one doesn't do "X" as well as another one I'm used to" ask if that is just because they are used to a different model not that the one they are reviewing is bad at it. Look at available accessories. Decide if you are going to buy a motor and VFD and if you want it in the whole package or other. If you are supplying the motor and using a step pulley system look at ease of set up. Same with supplying the motor yourself for direct drive. Since you haven't spent a lot of time with any grinder you will have about the same learning curve with any of them and you can adapt easily to any of the idiosyncrasies they all have. Keep as close to your planned budget as possible. Yes there are people who say "I should have ordered this and that" but look closely and you'll find folks saying "I have this and that that I ordered but ended up not using". When you think you have it all dialed in call whatever company you have chosen and speak with them to make sure it will do what you expect the way you expect. Then order it and sit back, relax and wait for the fun to begin and don't look back when it arrives. Set it up and learn to use it, whichever one you chose, as well as you can.

I'm a Coote guy for my purposes, and it does have some nice accessories available despite the fact that many overlook that, but I don't think that my choice is right for everyone. I always thought "Ford vs Chevy" arguments were silly I have both plus a Dodge in my driveway.

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Thanks Vern. There is a lot out there. Right now I use an old Rockwell 1x42 with a 1hp. It works but quality belts are harder to find and my abilities have exceeded its capabilities at this point. I would really like to advance my hollow grinding with this purchase and that is where my questions start to rise. Do I get a flat or serrated wheel and what size etc? Thanks

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