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Jeremy Blohm

Welded axe

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This picture has he wondering about all the different methods of welding an axe? I've never thought of welding an axe like the front one facing away. I guess as long as you end up with the shape your after it shouldn't matter how you got there right?

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Pretty much.  Be careful looking at those Finnish socketed axes, they'll suck you in and never let you go!:lol: 

Most of Europe has/had some truly funky axe styles, more often than not involving a socket and some very creative welding and forging.  There's a book called "Hammered Symbols" that is the collection of one guy from Austria that shows over a hundred different axe types, all from a small region.  Often the shape changes from one valley to the next.

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Here's the book I mentioned:

 

http://bluemoonpress.org/index.php/hammered-symbols.html

 

And a video of the collection (all sorts of tools, not just axes).  It really helps if you speak German, but the pictures speak for themselves.

 

 

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Awesome...thank you!!!! I'm diving deep into this rabbit hole.

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Wow...what a collection!!! 

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Check out the poll of this axe!!!

72142116_973861122990519_1207330248519301692_n.jpg

 

Edited by Jeremy Blohm

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Another really cool welded axe.

 

images.jpeg

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On 11/19/2019 at 9:59 PM, Jeremy Blohm said:

I guess as long as you end up with the shape your after it shouldn't matter how you got there right?

Jeremy,that's cool that you're digging the ways axes were welded...there sure were many and sundry...

 

However,it Always matters how you "get there"...As in,it always matters a great deal how the forge-weld is oriented.

General rules is that a forge-weld is strongest in sheer,so many welds used in axes are positioned so that the plane of the weld is parallel to the forces that act on the axehead in use.

Both cleft-,and skew-welds are common in Germanic-Skandinavian types of axe construction,and those about cover it...(those welded-on polls are a simple butt-weld of course,the one you show above has a an obvious section of a rasp employed-good idea!:).

 

But,yes.They say that the maximum section of stock one can forge by hand is 5/8"(this means Forge,as in delivering a fully penetrating blow).

So an axe weighting 2-3-whatever pounds pretty much necessitates a composite const. method.  

 

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Basically,the decision is based on what is wanted/and how to get there most expeditiously.

 

For example,that axe you forged of late in Hot Work topic(great job,btw;my internet is intermittent,and i couldn't comment just then),you chose a type of axe that is essentially almost poll-less.

However,to create even the transition from poll to cheeks,as well as thin those some,and to make that transition forward all took time and energy.

 

Potentially,especially if were you up against a design that called for more variance in mass, you could accomplish it easier or faster by welding.

 

Heres a cool photo of a yet-unwelded components of an axe similar to one you posted:

47326350_1915488618563735_2444953332029063168_o.jpg

 

It is by a smith Mathieu Colette,from Montreal,here's his FB page:

https://www.facebook.com/pg/Taillanderie-Claudel-609826759129934/photos/?ref=page_internal

 

That photo doesn't really show that the middle piece that grips the blade and the front of socket is cleft on both ends,this kinda "bow-tie" shape in section.

The blade is forged from two more pieces,and socket is comprised of three more,so this particular method is a 6-piece construction. 

Edited by jake pogrebinsky
spacing out...
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On 11/24/2019 at 9:07 AM, Jeremy Blohm said:

Another really cool welded axe.

That is Finnish axe called Piilukirves,it is a hewing tool,specifically for levellin and planishing log walls in a very specific type of log-work they practice in Finland.

 

The one above is it's relative,possibly an ancestor,from Sweden in late Middle-ages...

referred to as "1700"...(by those that been falling down this rabbit-hole a while now:)

 

all this verbiage is to put forth an idea that it's not at all random,all these choices of methods of cobbling together an axehead...

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I was hoping you'd show up,  Jake!  B)

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That is really cool seeing that yet to be welded axe!!! I'm going to attempt to weld up a complicated axe like that someday. 

 

I'm off to check out Mathieu Colette's FB page.

 

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13 hours ago, jake pogrebinsky said:

General rules is that a forge-weld is strongest in sheer

 

I was under the impression that shear is where a forge weld is weakest.  All metals are weakest in shear, in fact the shear strength is half the tensile strength.  

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1 hour ago, Jerrod Miller said:

All metals are weakest in shear, in fact the shear strength is half the tensile strength.  

Jerrod,my apologies,i'm sure that i used that technical term incorrectly.

 

What i meant by that is that the weld is positioned in a Plane that parallels that of the force  in which the axe is used...Yet not exactly,as the two usually cross at a slight angle.

 

A good example of maximizing the efficiency of a weld in the the general forging practice of course is a chain-link...(i'll try to find a schematic in case someone is not familiar with that weld).

What happens there is for the weld to fail the two halves of a lapped joint must Slide past each other(or fail in tensile manner as you indicate as the strongest point).

That is what i meant to indicate by bringing in "sheer",obviously a misplaced term.

 

But the Idea of lap-weld used in chain-making is what works well in axe construction.

The Area of the weld is maximised too,for further security.

(although that is the stick of two ends-the smith has better have the skill to close the entire weld before it cools or oxidises,or he'd be better served by a weld of lesser area/better bond....   

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Thanks,Alan,possibly that's the engineering term?

 

And here i quickly stole some schematic off the net...It's representative enough of the Principle...(just wish they drew the weld areas larger,those stingy-looking welds make me cringe:)

AH637E63.gif

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It sounds like you did indeed use the terminology correctly.  The best example I generally have to describe shear is to place your hands together (palm to palm), then slide them as if you were trying to warm your hands.  

12 minutes ago, jake pogrebinsky said:

he'd be better served by a weld of lesser area/better bond....

I think this is the key.  While it is a weaker weld, there is a lot more of it to spread the load.  Like the chain link example, if you scarf a lot of material, you have a lot more area of weld to hold it.  Whereas if you do very little scarfing, you will want something better than a forge weld (like an electric arc weld, possibly with a better material filler than the base material).  

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Thanks,Jerrod,yes-that is a very good way to describe that action.

 

Here's a good example of a weld that failed to within about 50% of it's intent:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-J-B-Stohler-Axe-Head-Jersey-Type-Honed-to-a-Razor-Sharp-Edge-/202821916120?hash=item2f3920d5d8%3Ag%3AwJIAAOSwGEFdzH6E&nma=true&si=umXEE57fR%2B1XIUPiPUv78KWLIM0%3D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

 

If you look at all the photos there you'll see how one entire half of the cleft-weld holding the edge insert didn't make a bond...

Yet,that tool is all wore,it served in it's intended use well;the other half of that Very ample weld area has held up.

That is btw one of the best,most reputable American makers of late 19th-early 20th c.c.,J.B.Stohler,failures like this were Most uncommon for him.

Also,if you look carefully at the top views you'll see how the poll is comprised of 4 parts,3 laminated pieces(for added mass+room inside eye),and a hardened steel butt-plate,which helps secure that 3-part weld further. 

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