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Long blade - keeps twisting along it's axis


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Guys, I've run into a horrible problem.

Currently I am working on the biggest commission of my life, and this blade keeps twisting along it's axis no matter how many times I re-heat and hammer it down flat.

 

So, I've created this 40cm long blade, with 20cm long tang, consisting of 3 bars folded and twisted steel - as pr. my usual blades.

 

Currently I am trying to normalize the blade before moving forward with grinding the ricasso and edge onto it - however - the blade keeps twisting along it's axis every time I re-heat and hang it by the tang from the ceiling to cool down.

Normalization.jpg

 

 

I heat it up to welding temperature, beat the damn thing nice and flat, stick it back into the fire to get it to above critical again - then I hang it up to cool down. By the time the blade has cooled down, it has twisted itself right back into it's original warped shape.

 

At the moment I am at a complete loss as to what to do.

 

Please have a look at the video below to see in what exact way the blade is twisted / warped:

 

 

Any kind of input on this would be greatly appreciated! :unsure:

 

Sincerey, Alveprins.

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Straighten in a vice at normalising heat, just above critical, and repeat until it stops twisting - heating to welding heat and hammering is just compounding the stresses that are causing this...

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11 minutes ago, jake cleland said:

Straighten in a vice at normalising heat, just above critical, and repeat until it stops twisting - heating to welding heat and hammering is just compounding the stresses that are causing this...

 

Thanks for the feedback!

 

So, my vice jaws are much smaller than the blade.. that is, the blade is 4cm wide, and the jaws of the vice are maybe half of that.

I suppose I will have to create jaw inserts? Like, large flat pieces of steel?

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Or make a twisting wrench. Just a slot on some flat bar that fits the blade.  Make two. Put one in the vise, and hold the other one.  With these you can even straighten it cold.  You'll want these if it warps in the quench anyway.

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15 minutes ago, Alan Longmire said:

Or make a twisting wrench. Just a slot on some flat bar that fits the blade.  Make two. Put one in the vise, and hold the other one.  With these you can even straighten it cold.  You'll want these if it warps in the quench anyway.

Mr. Longmire, do you have any examples of how such twisting wrenches would look like?

 

EDIT: On second thought - I'm pretty sure I understand what you mean. :)

Edited by Alveprins
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To work with Jake's idea, use two pieces of wood (we call them 2x6 here in the states) and a couple of quick hand clamps. Lay one board on a nice flat table, lay the blade at normalizing heat on it. quickly cover with the other board and clamp the whole thing down tight to the table. Do the same thing when you go for the quench.

You can see the setup in the background of this video: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ne0kmIz9X48eI3k1rHwgi4qlv7RlctrB/view?usp=sharing

 

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4 hours ago, Joshua States said:

use two pieces of wood

Depending on blade alloy(s) used, these can even be metal.  You'll want to watch out for marring a bit more than with wood though.  

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5 minutes ago, Jerrod Miller said:

Depending on blade alloy(s) used, these can even be metal.  You'll want to watch out for marring a bit more than with wood though.  

Yeah, I was thinking of taking two 2x4's, cutting thick saw-blade metal sheets - and bolting them onto the 2x4, and then using these to clamp down the blade.

That way there will be metal against metal - while support structure will be wood. Then I avoid any unnecessary burning, and I can re-use the tool many times. :)

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1 hour ago, Alveprins said:

and I can re-use the tool many times.

I think we did 7 falchions in that class with the same two pieces of wood.

Edited by Joshua States
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Posted (edited)

Ok, so I've made myself a little setup with two 2x4's and two sheets of sawblade steel.

 

Here is the blade, all clamped down...

 

Going down to have a look right now. Do I wait until it cools down to near room temperature, or what?

Solution 01.jpg

 

Solution 02.jpg

 

Solution 03.jpg

 

excited to have a look

 

EDIT: By Odin's eye! It is straight! :lol: Thank you so much guys for your input! Invaluable! :D

Edited by Alveprins
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Btw, do I need to repeat this process.. like 3 times?

I have normalized 3 times already without this clamping. The clamping session makes it number 4....

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I wouldn't think you need to normalize any more.  If anything, this clamping would be an extra good normalizing cycle.  

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Do the same thing out of the quench and you should be good to go.

 

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11 hours ago, Jerrod Miller said:

I wouldn't think you need to normalize any more.  If anything, this clamping would be an extra good normalizing cycle.  

 

3 hours ago, Joshua States said:

Do the same thing out of the quench and you should be good to go.

 

 

Alright guys, I'll proceed to grinding the blade then. :)

 

Thanks for all the good tips. I'll let everyone know how it goes after quench, whether or not it warps. :)

 

Sincerely, Alveprins.

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