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Coffin Frame Dagger Build


Joshua States
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Chubby?!?! OK, now I'm laughing. As I said earlier, I am considering fluting this handle. I bought a video course by Kyle Royer on handle fluting (I highly recommend this) and I really want to try it out on something. I did a little sketch work today.

V2 fluted.jpg

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“So I'm lightin' out for the territory, ahead of the scared and the weak and the mean spirited, because Aunt Sally is fixin’ to adopt me and civilize me, and I can't stand it. I've been there before.”

The only bad experience is the one from which you learn nothing.  

 

Josh

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2 hours ago, Alan Longmire said:

That'll do! :lol:

The pomell looks too small. I'll have to do something there.

“So I'm lightin' out for the territory, ahead of the scared and the weak and the mean spirited, because Aunt Sally is fixin’ to adopt me and civilize me, and I can't stand it. I've been there before.”

The only bad experience is the one from which you learn nothing.  

 

Josh

http://www.dosgatosdesignsllc.com/#!

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdJMFMqnbLYqv965xd64vYg

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I feel the handle could use more swell toward the guard and taper into to pommel rather than swell in middle however fluted takes away the “chubby” appearance. I have no clue how this could affect fluting.


(like I could even attempt to do anything close too this!) 

 

Gary LT

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"I Never Met A Knife I Didn't Like", (Will Rogers)

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1 hour ago, Gary LT said:

more swell toward the guard and taper into to pommel rather than swell in middle

I have been looking at the shapes and profiles of fluted dagger handles for some time now. It has been on my "to-do" list ever since I learned about the ABS test criteria, and that was many moons ago.....

 

When you start to realize that there is no "correct" shape to these, you loose the constraints and open up the possibilities. Some are flatter on the sides, some are more rounded. They all have some sort of double taper along the handle edges. Whether that taper is longer from the swell to the pommel or longer from the swell to the quillon, seems to be a maker's choice sort of thing. 

 

I have seen some that have a prounounced swell towards the front spacer and a very long taper towards the pomelll. MS Steve Culver does this quite often, whereas MS Kyle Royer puts the swell more toward the center. 

 

I will play around with moving the swell forward and see what I think. Thanks for the suggestion.

 

“So I'm lightin' out for the territory, ahead of the scared and the weak and the mean spirited, because Aunt Sally is fixin’ to adopt me and civilize me, and I can't stand it. I've been there before.”

The only bad experience is the one from which you learn nothing.  

 

Josh

http://www.dosgatosdesignsllc.com/#!

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdJMFMqnbLYqv965xd64vYg

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I hand sanded the fullers out to 320 yesterday.

 

V2 Side (1).jpg

 

V2 Side (2).jpg

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“So I'm lightin' out for the territory, ahead of the scared and the weak and the mean spirited, because Aunt Sally is fixin’ to adopt me and civilize me, and I can't stand it. I've been there before.”

The only bad experience is the one from which you learn nothing.  

 

Josh

http://www.dosgatosdesignsllc.com/#!

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdJMFMqnbLYqv965xd64vYg

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Today was a forge day for me and I worked on 4 Damascus bars and a chunk of 1095. (Stay tuned for more stuff in that lecture on Damascus thread). One of the bars is a bold and lower layer twisted bar for the fittings on this dagger.

 

So here is the idea. If I can pull this off, I will be very happy.

 

V2 Quillon idea.jpg

 

Here is the twisted bar. It was about 5/8" square before twisting. I did smack down the corners a little and made it a little tighter after this pic was taken.

 

Twisted bar.jpg

 

I partially requared it, spread and flattened a portion. This is now a little wider than 1" and about .27" thick.

 

Rough bar (1).jpg

 

The back portion is still square(ish) and will become the pommel in a 4-way stack.

 

Rough bar (2).jpg

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“So I'm lightin' out for the territory, ahead of the scared and the weak and the mean spirited, because Aunt Sally is fixin’ to adopt me and civilize me, and I can't stand it. I've been there before.”

The only bad experience is the one from which you learn nothing.  

 

Josh

http://www.dosgatosdesignsllc.com/#!

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdJMFMqnbLYqv965xd64vYg

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On your marks........

 

V2 ready.jpg

 

 

Get set!..........

 

V2 get Set.jpg

 

 

 

Switch to plan B......

 

V2 switch to plan B.jpg

Edited by Joshua States

“So I'm lightin' out for the territory, ahead of the scared and the weak and the mean spirited, because Aunt Sally is fixin’ to adopt me and civilize me, and I can't stand it. I've been there before.”

The only bad experience is the one from which you learn nothing.  

 

Josh

http://www.dosgatosdesignsllc.com/#!

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdJMFMqnbLYqv965xd64vYg

J.States Bladesmith | Facebook

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Back at it today after prepping a new twisted bar last weekend. This was some delicate forging using the O/A torch and a number of bicks, small anvils, and a guillotine fuller. 

I fit it to the blade and decided I needed to reduce the straight portion.

 

Try #2 (1)(1).jpg

 

Starting to make the curves.

Try #2 (2).jpg

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“So I'm lightin' out for the territory, ahead of the scared and the weak and the mean spirited, because Aunt Sally is fixin’ to adopt me and civilize me, and I can't stand it. I've been there before.”

The only bad experience is the one from which you learn nothing.  

 

Josh

http://www.dosgatosdesignsllc.com/#!

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdJMFMqnbLYqv965xd64vYg

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  • 2 weeks later...

Minor progress, and I'm not sure I like this at all. I finished the forging on the guard.

 

Finished forging.jpg

 

Finished forging 2.jpg

 

Then I made and fit the 5-piece spacer package. Two twist Damascus plates and three .04" nickel-silver plates.

 

Hancock spacer.jpg

 

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“So I'm lightin' out for the territory, ahead of the scared and the weak and the mean spirited, because Aunt Sally is fixin’ to adopt me and civilize me, and I can't stand it. I've been there before.”

The only bad experience is the one from which you learn nothing.  

 

Josh

http://www.dosgatosdesignsllc.com/#!

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdJMFMqnbLYqv965xd64vYg

J.States Bladesmith | Facebook

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  • 2 weeks later...

Awesome work! Love the fuller. Looking forward to seeing it done!

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"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly; who errs and comes short again and again; because there is not effort without error and shortcomings; but who does actually strive to do the deed; who knows the great enthusiasm, the great devotion, who spends himself in a worthy cause, who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement and who at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly." -- Theodore Roosevelt

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1 hour ago, Dave Stephens said:

Awesome work! Love the fuller. Looking forward to seeing it done!

Thanks man. You have been one of those makers whose work always inspires me. I have a couple of commissions I need to get to work on and this is a side project now, so it will move off the current bench onto the on-deck bench for a bit.

“So I'm lightin' out for the territory, ahead of the scared and the weak and the mean spirited, because Aunt Sally is fixin’ to adopt me and civilize me, and I can't stand it. I've been there before.”

The only bad experience is the one from which you learn nothing.  

 

Josh

http://www.dosgatosdesignsllc.com/#!

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdJMFMqnbLYqv965xd64vYg

J.States Bladesmith | Facebook

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Great to see you and everyone else still in the fight. I've been so tangled up in keeping the company afloat due to Covid I haven't put hammer to anvil in a very long time. Feel like I'm losing a part of my soul. Thanks for the inspiration.

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"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly; who errs and comes short again and again; because there is not effort without error and shortcomings; but who does actually strive to do the deed; who knows the great enthusiasm, the great devotion, who spends himself in a worthy cause, who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement and who at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly." -- Theodore Roosevelt

http://stephensforge.com

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  • 9 months later...

Well, this has been sitting on the bench craving some attention for a while. Every attempt I have made at forging the ring hilt out of a single piece has produced more Damascus scap than I care to acknowledge. That will now have to wait until I get more steel to make new billets. In the meanwhile, I have redesigned the whole thing around the blade.

 

It is now a frame handle design. I may still try and put a ring on the guard or attach a Nagel sort of thing following the coffin shape motif. We will see how that works out. Here is the new handle design.

 

Design Drawing.jpg

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“So I'm lightin' out for the territory, ahead of the scared and the weak and the mean spirited, because Aunt Sally is fixin’ to adopt me and civilize me, and I can't stand it. I've been there before.”

The only bad experience is the one from which you learn nothing.  

 

Josh

http://www.dosgatosdesignsllc.com/#!

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdJMFMqnbLYqv965xd64vYg

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For those of you unfamiliar with the frame handle process, I have posted a separate thread with all the steps.

This will show a shortened version. 

The actual frame is twist Damascus with some nickel-silver liners. This is different fom the previous method in that I am starting with a 2-piece construction. I take a flattened, twisted bar and split it in half. The hole is drilled where the bar needs to be bent to accomodate the turn in the handle profile.

 

Frame stock (2).jpg

 

These are then surfaced again, laid onto the piece of 1/4" MDF board.

 

Fame process (1).jpg

 

and arranged under the template for drilling.

Fame process (2).jpg

 

The liners are done in the same manner as in the How I do Them post.

After dilling and removing the excess, the finished frame and liners are now ready for the scales.

 

Frame & Liners (2).jpg

 

Frame & Liners (1).jpg

Edited by Joshua States
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“So I'm lightin' out for the territory, ahead of the scared and the weak and the mean spirited, because Aunt Sally is fixin’ to adopt me and civilize me, and I can't stand it. I've been there before.”

The only bad experience is the one from which you learn nothing.  

 

Josh

http://www.dosgatosdesignsllc.com/#!

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdJMFMqnbLYqv965xd64vYg

J.States Bladesmith | Facebook

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  • 3 weeks later...

This weekend I managed to fit the handle scales, rough shape the guard, HT the fittings, and profile the handle to 400 grit. Later this week, I will shape the handle and etch the frame and spacers.

The fittings after HT.

 

HT fittings.jpg

 

Dry fit the handle with spacer package

 

Rough Assembly 1.jpg

 

Dry fit the handle with the guard

 

Rough Assembly 2.jpg

 

I really need to pay more attention to what is behind the subject in the photo. That old sock sticking out of the orange bucket isn't doing me any favors here.

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“So I'm lightin' out for the territory, ahead of the scared and the weak and the mean spirited, because Aunt Sally is fixin’ to adopt me and civilize me, and I can't stand it. I've been there before.”

The only bad experience is the one from which you learn nothing.  

 

Josh

http://www.dosgatosdesignsllc.com/#!

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdJMFMqnbLYqv965xd64vYg

J.States Bladesmith | Facebook

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  • Joshua States changed the title to Coffin Frame Dagger Build

Dang dude, this is awesome.

 

On 11/27/2022 at 10:38 PM, Joshua States said:

I really need to pay more attention to what is behind the subject in the photo. That old sock sticking out of the orange bucket isn't doing me any favors here.

 

Ha, when I first saw that pic, I thought "There is no way Joshua would be that far off on even a dry fit-up" so I had to look closer to see that the background was blending in with the handle.  You got the benefit of the doubt though :)

 

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-Brian

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So the handle got shaped. I may still thin it down a little more though. The finial got turned and groud down to resemble the coffin shape. (a butt strike will be like getting stabbed with a flat head screwdriver). The tang extension got threaded and everything fits together nicely.

Dry fit 1.jpg

 

Side view

Dry fit side.jpg

 

Full shot

 

Dry fit full.jpg

 

I etched all the pieces parts yesterday which was almost catastrophic. (note to self: remember to check the threaded rod used is really the stainless steel one and not the zinc plated one) I have to re-etch the guard again due to some minor zinc plating......

 

Now I will file work the liners.

Edited by Joshua States
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“So I'm lightin' out for the territory, ahead of the scared and the weak and the mean spirited, because Aunt Sally is fixin’ to adopt me and civilize me, and I can't stand it. I've been there before.”

The only bad experience is the one from which you learn nothing.  

 

Josh

http://www.dosgatosdesignsllc.com/#!

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdJMFMqnbLYqv965xd64vYg

J.States Bladesmith | Facebook

https://www.facebook.com/dos.gatos.71

https://www.etsy.com/shop/JStatesBladesmith

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