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Refractory Cement


Matthew McKenzie

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As the topic title states, is one refractory cement better than another? I've seen many people here say they use Satinite, but for whatever reason, I'm having trouble finding purchasing information for it online. I am seeing a great deal of links pointing to Rutland refractory cement, though.

 

Is a specific type of refractory cement more desirable than another? Why?

 

Are there specific qualities I should be looking for in a refractory cement? What are they?

 

Where do you get your refractory cement?

MacGyver is my patron saint.

 

"There's nothing in the universe cold steel won't cut." -Conan of Cimmeria-

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Most pottery suppliers will carry it and you would avoid the shipping costs by getting it local. On my last forge I used Minrox 3000 which was $80 a Lbs. but it's some tough stuff and has held up great so far without any cracking. I coated it with APG 36 which is holding up better then ITC 100 ever did and it's much less expensive.

Everything I need to know I learned from the people trapped in my basement.

 

 

I'm out of my mind but feel free to leave a message.

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Firstley if you are useing it to line the forge YES FACTORY CEMENT if you are coating the blades you need REFACTORY MORTER two different materials the satanite is Morter not cement

 

cement is to stick the bricks together in the forge mortor is a lining material

 

cheers terry look in the links section for a supplyer in you country

Terence.........(today started off perfect now --- watch sombody come and stuff it up ]

 

if it aint broke dont fix it

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I get my satanite from Darren Ellis http://home.comcast.net/~eellis2/EllisCust...rycoatings.html

He is really great.

My life is like shaving with a razor sharp machete. It's a bit awkward and I feel a sting every now and then, but in the end I'm happy with the results.

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I was going to mention Ellis Custom Knifeworks but I was beaten to it. A lot of people do use Satanite to coat the inside of a ceramic fiber lined forge with to help prevent putting small particles of silicates in the air and their lungs but I haven't been happy with it for that use. There is not much stregth to it and it's easy to punch trough into the fiber which results in frequent patching. It's also not very flux resistant. I like Mizzou refractory for coating the inside of a fiber lined forge. It's much harder and flux resistant. I haven't punched trough the Mizzou lining on mine yet. You can also cast the whole forge body out of it, though Darrel Ellis states that another product that he sells has better insulating qualities than Mizzou. Darrel carries Satanite, Mizzou, the rammable refractory I mentioned above and other refractory products.

 

Doug Lester

HELP...I'm a twenty year old trapped in the body of an old man!!!

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I should have specified that I was asking about blade-coating. Apologies. However, I'm going to be working on building a bigger gas forge in the near future and this is giving me all new things to think about and more information on the subject. Thank you all for your help, and thanks especially for the pointer to Darren Ellis.

MacGyver is my patron saint.

 

"There's nothing in the universe cold steel won't cut." -Conan of Cimmeria-

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Your welcome. He is the man. I will gladly send customers his way in a heart beat. I'm a little biased because I got superb customer service.

 

Doug, I bought that other castable when I had to reline my forge when my mizzou finally died. I can say that it does insulate a LOT better than the mizzou. One caveat on that stuff is that it does not like to stick to ceramic wool. I had not heeded what Darrin Ellis told me and just cast the the lining and to use the wool as an outside insulation. So guess what I did today. It sucks when you get head strong and end up wasting material.

My life is like shaving with a razor sharp machete. It's a bit awkward and I feel a sting every now and then, but in the end I'm happy with the results.

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I am a fairly recent convert from satanite to Rutland's cement for coating blades. Two different products that act very differently.

 

Both are mixed with water to desired consistancy.

 

I like the Rutland's because it is very smooth, which helps with my application to the blade. It also very sticky. I can brush on a thin layer to the blade, let sit about 10 minutes, then apply the rest of the clay with ashi and everything. Works great.

 

The downside is perhaps the dry time. I'm told you can go straight to the forge with it but it puffs up all funny when you do. Changes my clay layout somewhat and you have to compensate for it. With satanite, I applied clay and went to forge with no dry time. The Rutlands needs a day or two (or maybe a hair dryer or something). It still puffs a little, but not as much as when "new".

 

Another interesting thing, the satanite cleans up fairly easy. Whether unfired (say screwed up somehow before quenching) or fired (it washes off with water either way). The Rutland's is tough stuff after it dries, like chisel and wire brush tough. Doesn't wash off. I'm bad for leaving clay on my application tools and tray. The satanite comes right off a week later. If you leave the Rutland's laying around for more than a couple hours, it's jackhammer time. Also, it's tough to get off the blade after quenching. Some pops off like any other clay but, there's a thick residue that is a beotch to get off. I usually just slack belt on the grinder with a 60 grit. Not good for the lungs kids, so respirators.

 

Just my latest observations.

 

Dan

Dan Pfanenstiel

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