dan pfanenstiel Posted April 8, 2008 Share Posted April 8, 2008 I've been doing a lot in the 'ol shop with hamon developement, and think I'm finally getting somewhere. I've done something similar and interesting now on W1/1095, 1050, and some layered steel that's probably 1095/mild. It's good to get it back. Dan Dan Pfanenstiel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jziegenbein Posted April 8, 2008 Share Posted April 8, 2008 that is a great hamon tons of action. jared Z. lilzee on britishblades. From now on, ending a sentence with a preposition is something up with which I will not put. -Sir Winston Churchill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Salvati Posted April 8, 2008 Share Posted April 8, 2008 (edited) OHH VERY SWEET. Care to share how you got that most awesome hamon Dan? Edited April 8, 2008 by Sam Salvati Let not the swords of good and free men be reforged into plowshares, but may they rest in a place of honor; ready, well oiled and God willing unused. For if the price of peace becomes licking the boots of tyrants, then "To Arms!" I say, and may the fortunes of war smile upon patriots Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwilliams Posted April 8, 2008 Share Posted April 8, 2008 Now thats Nice. Chris Chris Williams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.Knowles Posted April 8, 2008 Share Posted April 8, 2008 Oh I love it when they "drip". Very Nice! Shawn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastvillage Posted April 8, 2008 Share Posted April 8, 2008 o yes that's very nice! love the action that is taking place. Greetings Toni http://www.eastvillageknives.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guarnera Posted April 8, 2008 Share Posted April 8, 2008 Nice one Dan. Congrats! Tony G Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raymond Richard Posted April 8, 2008 Share Posted April 8, 2008 Dan, Where did your mojo go? I really can't see that you missed a beat. Good to see you back around! Raymond Richard www.hawknknives.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Stagmer Posted April 8, 2008 Share Posted April 8, 2008 Sweet! I just started playing with hamons...you def have to have the feel. "ART SHOULD HURT" www.BaltimoreKnife.com BKS' Facebook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan pfanenstiel Posted April 8, 2008 Author Share Posted April 8, 2008 (edited) Thanks all. Hey Ray. I've had a spell where nothing would come out right. Either that or I had set my standards too high. Made a lot of junk this last year. Sam, this particualar blade was just pulled out of the junk pile to do some treating tests on. I'm pretty sure this one is 1050 steel, but I've gotten good results on W1/1095 and layered steels. Not much to add to the techniques written about here on the forums except to really pay attentions to what it took to get a good finished hamon. Temperatures, heat cycles, time, testing and observation. My own personal definition of hamon is not just something that randomly occurs, which has been my technique in the past. I have tried many time to achieve "what I want" in one shot tries, but had to accept whatever outcome. My definition of hamon includes some control of the outcome and repeatable results, to a certain degree. Otherwise I'm creating "temper lines" or differential hardening or whatever you want to call it, not hamon. Hence the latest drive in the shop. Dan Edited April 8, 2008 by dan pfanenstiel Dan Pfanenstiel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McAhron Posted April 9, 2008 Share Posted April 9, 2008 Dan if I recall you are using a forge and magnet to judge temperature.Sorry if my memory is wrong.I think temperature and soaking are the two most important hamon factors besides steel selection.I built a 33" vertical kiln for less than 300.It allows me to keep an even and exact temperature range and prevents gravity warp which occurs on long pieces of steel in a horizontal forge/kiln.I have found from experience,testing, and great advice from others that holding the steel at a little less than critical for 5-10 minutes helps hamon activity tremendously.I finally got some parks 50 awhile back and its wonderful stuff.Maybe switching to parks and eleminating the water quench as the water itself is probably inconsistant.I think the less variables involved the more consistant your quenching will be.If you know the steel,quenchent,temp,and soak times and keep a record of your results you will be able to see why something worked one time and not another.I now get fairly consistant hamons in 1095 that follow the patterns in clay.I never was able to before I built the kiln.Now I am ready to give some of the 2" w2 a try. N'T McAhron Sqwaukin Vulture Verrinder "to create is to make art" TREMBLING EARTH KNIFE WORKS (website coming soon) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Pringle Posted April 9, 2008 Share Posted April 9, 2008 Congrats, Dan! Jomsvikingar Raða Ja! http://vikingswordsmith.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan pfanenstiel Posted April 9, 2008 Author Share Posted April 9, 2008 Hey Mcahron, good yer still around. How was BACKA this last year? First time I've missed that show in years. I have played with soak times in a salt pot, but it was problematic for me. I need to re-test it in the future. I'm trying to hit a baseline to work from now and will try things as I get settled again. Got some people waiting on me for finished work and my self-imposed-2-year-sabatical-to-play-in-the-shop is quickly coming to an end. I am now using Parks 50, and the electric oven needs some tinkering, but the forge is funner (more fun, funnest?) Thanks Jeff. I need you to look at some wootz I've got sometime and give me some advice on it. Oakland ain't that far. Dan Dan Pfanenstiel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McAhron Posted April 9, 2008 Share Posted April 9, 2008 I couldnt do Backa because of the rheumatoid.I couldnt even walk this last fall.Im much better now.I went to the show and it was terrible.Very few tables,low sales,a third the size of 3 years ago.I doubt there will be one this year.Its a shame that it has fallen into such dissarray.Sorry to hear the two years went so quickly.I hope all is well with you and yours,McAhron. N'T McAhron Sqwaukin Vulture Verrinder "to create is to make art" TREMBLING EARTH KNIFE WORKS (website coming soon) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt venier Posted April 9, 2008 Share Posted April 9, 2008 From someone who's been trying to affect hamon the way I want it, that is some serious mojo! Matt There's no kissaki like an O-kissaki!http://www.venierdesign.com/Venier_Design_Inc./Welcome.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Moss Posted April 9, 2008 Share Posted April 9, 2008 that is a really pretty hamon! how do you heat your blades? and what do you quench with? i am just getting to the same point.. where i can get it to do kinda what i want. thanks for showing! ~Chris -Knifemaker- http://knifemaker87.googlepages.com/home Hamons are a painting; blades are a canvas, clay is my paint, fire is my brush. the problem is.. i am still painting like Pablo Picasso. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan pfanenstiel Posted April 10, 2008 Author Share Posted April 10, 2008 (edited) Here's one I re-treated when I got home from work (remember when you couldn't wait to get home from work/school/whatever to get out into the shop?) This one is W1 steel forged down from round bar. I had finished this one previously, right down the finished polish, but was never satisfied with it completely. Guys, these are done with the simplest of tools for heat treating. A forge, a tank of quench oil and a bit of experience. Some of that experience from others on this forum and some of my own. BTW, both these blades are "quick sanded" at 600 grit and light etched twice and rubbed out. Then an even quicker picture. Dan Edited April 10, 2008 by dan pfanenstiel Dan Pfanenstiel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt venier Posted April 10, 2008 Share Posted April 10, 2008 Hey Dan Is that 1050 also? looks good Matt There's no kissaki like an O-kissaki!http://www.venierdesign.com/Venier_Design_Inc./Welcome.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Stagmer Posted April 10, 2008 Share Posted April 10, 2008 He said it was forged from a W1 round bar. Like you did at the hammer in. So you quenched that w1 into oil and still got that sharp hamon ? "ART SHOULD HURT" www.BaltimoreKnife.com BKS' Facebook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt venier Posted April 10, 2008 Share Posted April 10, 2008 (edited) Oh yeah it says W1 right there Oh well I've been a little sick the past few days, Edited April 10, 2008 by matt venier There's no kissaki like an O-kissaki!http://www.venierdesign.com/Venier_Design_Inc./Welcome.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan pfanenstiel Posted April 10, 2008 Author Share Posted April 10, 2008 So you quenched that w1 into oil and still got that sharp hamon ? Yup, everything lately's been heated in a forge, quenched in Parks #50. Furnace cement for clay. I'm liking things simple. Dan Dan Pfanenstiel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Stagmer Posted April 11, 2008 Share Posted April 11, 2008 I find it hard to spend half a day shaping a blade just to throw the dice and try quenching in water. "ART SHOULD HURT" www.BaltimoreKnife.com BKS' Facebook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan pfanenstiel Posted April 11, 2008 Author Share Posted April 11, 2008 I resisted anything but water for a long time, Matt. I changed to the oil for the same reason as you cited there. Only other concern was that I wouldn't be able to get the activity I wanted from the oil, but that doesn't seem to be an issue now. Dan Dan Pfanenstiel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimWestover Posted April 13, 2008 Share Posted April 13, 2008 Very nice blades both! I really like the hamon on the first one and the second on looks just incredibly wickedly sharp and pointy! When you swithced to Parks #50 for quenching did you notice any loss in sori? I have heard that oil doesn't give sori but makes the hamon not as crisp as water quench, but those hamons both look really nice and well defined. Keep up the good work and thanks for the pics. Blow ye winds like the trumpet blows. But without that sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan pfanenstiel Posted April 13, 2008 Author Share Posted April 13, 2008 Hey Tim, thanks. Ya, the oil causes a downturn rather than an upturn like water. You have to pre-plan for the quench media but it's fairly easy with the oil as my blades tend to have a sori like curve after forging anyways. Takes a lot of work to get things dead straight for water quench for some reason. Dan Dan Pfanenstiel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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